1 10 2 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/ed547cc628089cd280174e5a95147785.jpg?Expires=1785369600&Signature=leIujTzqmysHvsOEhqZhB16ct5nxO06ZSTDNDCdF%7E5QrPcMxBvhKBgweINtzMQfnDyejmavlv6zPLFj107I0i-eTKXBxH4DzggG%7EYEBD95gydGUtRwbMXHxXCjOA5K5wFdYR3cpTuc2qV5hDO2fQ708GZ7mMzkboYeI8j8GlD%7E5bgo9UIPbbZKcBGscS45jk624-Ew8kCt3%7EY3BObC27XY-CGBDx9opEhVG4CzEEoZ5MyC-jbThn0haqnBmHA1eAgGD3O4g0u7lz5przhGEWaiwDhbeqbSit5bZOMALHminBHWJl0auN05SinXMmONfR1B0pYdvS5fdTIT3JW2x45g__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 258439a14c1aff39f8b738545207d02b https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/7236748152e2db632c68bcfe5bb33cf7.m4a?Expires=1785369600&Signature=DglrbdnFCLbMFT72GWD%7EzCZSZQ-82szfgy6S5e0NABrctpj2LlksUhRomZgMsR6imPFjGeJ7iHYCUjUCjo4e0B5KGr5p%7EqusoBUbEWyc5d7PkSb4xAjMXKFWOe8%7EBEd6QyNkkzyd4ftgXRvhNXEDzSlV73SuyqeFyirmHunTKbUmI9YgGcVekfDyw7syNxsrw9Qi5tA8dFvtbBq%7EhZKwqWICnvANdHwyxURLLzhHFA9ec6Rs2pqty4UDYYTOY3Xjoo-j%7EzeGbn5alruPovkpniWW6dZGb6p9kDHD7AsJESCKCoIiv9Q2FNscGuM9Qxb5H2v2k2wQG-u3rFX2%7E%7E8jDQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 9b9ef0bc82a7c08d39f807314049ec52 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/4b30b599216bc02ca3d1fd666baa6701.pdf?Expires=1785369600&Signature=opjL9kTIomh3DWw3N%7EoWmNPdVYEayhDY9FlBIcBc-oWuS4bMPcUB%7EnKvvhGiKti67t0ICct1isrJ9c1tuAyVj-hDo3JokKkq0cw7UXb21cwiUakdxakBq-9rI4GgLcj2AZau7v%7E6G4VqYQPaRO8spYLPf0ouiskiyCz0ZIHAGpocV-O0blPqteuKZFoYbaoCdPEq5cZqfWlLdi5Iw-q7cdcgALcvMQYZI7INMvMpyoIF9VgDsXbpF56V3T5r3oCYeZYb9uhqjAY2W6FAOZFWG%7Eck-vyczJ2hBNJuslsZg5gtOvJ1PMwOK4CW8cfmQIJ%7ECURyV2Do8rsqZ2iDimkU0g__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM c357ff9ff08eaa39dd9231c329bee052 PDF Text Text 1 Transcript for Oral History Interview Conducted for University of Maryland Course: HIST465 – Spring 2023 Instructor: Dr. Anne S. Rush Interviewer’s Name: Aidan Lambiotte Interviewee’s Name: Mary Tsiolas Interviewee’s Country of Origin: Canada Interviewee’s Current of Residence: Takoma Park, Maryland, Montgomery County, USA Date of Interview: March 6th, 2023 Place of Interview: Takoma Park, Maryland, Montgomery County, USA Type of Interview: In Person Introduction: This interview is between Aidan Lambiotte and his aunt, Mary Tsiolis, a Greek Canadian immigrant to the United States. As the daughter of Greek immigrants to Quebec, Mary depicts her early childhood, and experiences growing up in both Greece and Monrtréal during the 1960s - 1970s. She draws stark contrasts between her experiences in Canada and her initial time as an immigrant in America, touching heavily on the themes of isolation, microaggression, and white suburban hegemony in the United States. She ultimately uses her experiences to illustrate the manner in which she found community in the DC area, entirely outside of Greek or Canadian culture, as well as her love-hate relationship with American identity. Keywords: Partie Quebecois, isolation, community, Suburbs, healthcare, music, politics Aidan: Okay, um, this is Aidan Lambiotte here with Mary Tsiolas, In Takoma Park, Maryland, at 3:22PM on, it is, today is March 6th, Monday March 6th, 2023. Um so to start, can you tell me your, your name, your age, your place of birth, and your date of birth? Mary: Okay, um, my name is Mary Tsiolas, uh, I was born in Montreal Canada, March 27th, 1959, so I will be 64 [on] March 27th, 2023. Um… Aidan: Good? Mary: That's about it! Aidan: Okay good, um, and, so, so to start we kind of just want to get a good sense of what your childhood was like, what your early life was like, so if you could, um, can you tell me about the environment you grew up in? Mary: I grew up in a Greek, I grew up with a Greek family, where my parents are from Greece, they migrated to Canada when they were teenagers, in 1957, and then when I was three years old, and my �2 sister was one year old, we went to live with my grandparents in Greece, so we could learn the language, and spend time with them. Then, we moved back to Canada, when I was nine or ten years old, probably nine, nine and a half. And uh, [we] lived in Canada until 1980, and then we moved to the US in 1980. Aidan: Okay, and so, so to backtrack a little bit, can you tell me about, uh, like what a normal day was like when you were in Greece when you were young, as much as you can remember? Mary: Uh we lived in the country, it was beautiful, we had a lot of friends because there was a really, um, a very tight knit neighborhood, and everyone played with each other, it was very carefree, it was very trusting, nobody locked doors, and it was beautiful. Aidan: Good, and what was your daily routine like? Did you go to school there? Mary: Yes, I went to elem-- kindergarten and elementary school there, uh, it was Greek school all day, except we had once a week an English cla-- English class, and it was the basics, and, um, so I can read and write Greek. And then when we moved to Canada, I went to a special English class, to pick up on my English, and then within six months I was placed in my grade, my English grade, in the Canadian school. Aidan: I see, and what was the name of the place in Greece where you were? Mary: The town? The name is Levidi, and it's a very small town in the province, the state is Arcadia in the Peloponnese. Aidan: Okay, very good. Um, yeah, so, so what, you said that you, you were in elementary school in Greece, um, when you came back to Canada after a few years in Greece, what were some differences that you noticed, or were there any differences that you noticed between the educational systems of, like, your Greek school versus you Canadian school, or-Mary: Oh, it was like day and night. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: Uh Greek school, uh, we were in the country so it was structured with a very long lunch break, where everyone went home for lunch and then we all went back to school in the afternoon, um, it was, um, it was very hard, it was, um we did a lot of uh, there was a lot of classes, a lot of classes that I didn't have in Canada like calligraphy classes at a very young age, and, um, and like really, outdoor gym, that was really kind of rough for us being young, and, um, Canada was much more indoors, nobody went home for lunch. Oh no we did go home for lunch, yes we did, we lived close, and so we did go home for lunch, the school, uh, had a break for a couple of hours and then we went back in the afternoon. Um, it was very structured, um, it was tough in the beginning, because, um, it was hard for me as a young child because I had to learn English very fast, because I wanted to have friends and I wanted to be able to communicate. Aidan: Mm-hm. �3 Mary: So, television helped a lot. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: A Lot of TV, and a lot of special classes, and I was very young, so we picked it up very fast, my sister and I. Aidan: Yeah, were there any, um, were you mostly--so, in French Canada, were you watching French TV? Mary: It was in English Canada then. Aidan: Really? Mary: Yes, because Partie Quebecois didn't take over until much later, so I was there in the 70s. Aidan: Oh so it was predominantly English? Mary: English, yes. Aidan: Ah okay, I didn't know that. Mary: Quebec, Quebec was predominantly English, yes, absolutely, yes. Aidan: Ah I didn't know that, okay. Mary: Yeah so, when we left in like, late 70s, in 79, 1979 to 1980 when we moved here, it was starting to change. Aidan: Starting to change. I see. Mary: Yes, to where all the English public schools were closing, and there were primarily French, and, you know, all that changed then. Aidan: I see, okay. Mary: So, there was a huge migration out of Can--out of Montreal then, a lot of the English, uh, speaking folks, and a lot of the Europeans that wanted to maintain their kid’s education in English, they left to go to English speaking parts of Canada, which pretty much Toronto, like, got flooded overnight basically. Aidan: Interesting. Mary: Yeah. �4 Aidan: Okay, um, so, kind of going back to education, a little bit, so once you came back to Greece, and because you had a fairly long amount of time in the educational system of Canada. Mary: Right. Aidan: Um, I guess, like, what was that like especially as you started to grow, and started to um, when you, when you get to, you know, when you reach adolescence and wanted to, um, you know-Mary: It was very different in Canada, because at the time all the schools were cut in half, half the school was all French, and the other half of the school was all English. And so, we basically-- and the English, um, English side, we had to take French, and if we didn't pass our French class we would flunk, and it was the same thing for the French side, the kids, they had to take English, and it was a primary subject, so if they failed it they would fail their class. So, that was a little, that was weird because people didn't really hang out together, the English side of the cafeteria, I mean there was an English side of the cafeteria speaking kids, the Anglophones, and the Francophones were on the other side, and a lot of them did not really connect, and so it was really a little bit rough when you're younger, because, coming from an ethnic family, you know, we had Greek school, we had English school, we had Greek school on the weekend and French school. So, it was a lot of work. Aidan: A lot of education. Mary: A lot, a lot, it was like a lot pushed at us, but it was, it was a good thing. Aidan: Okay, so-Mary: But hard at the time. Aidan: So, your, so your daily routine consisted of a lot of, a lot of schooling. Mary: Yes, I had never seen a, um, an open book test, until I moved to the US. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: And that was shocking. Aidan: Yeah. Mary: Because when I moved to the US, I had finished high school in Canada, but I needed to get the equivalent to the American high school, uh, diploma. I needed to take American history, and US government. So, at the time they, they, they only would let us take, not two courses, but four courses, so I ended up taking English, American government, US history, and I think it was art or something. Aidan: Okay, okay. �5 Mary: Yeah. Aidan: Um, so, kind of, sort of, just to get a better sense of what Montreal was like for you. Mary: Mm-hm Aidan: Um, is there a large immigrant community in Montreal? That you? Mary: Yes. Aidan: Okay. Mary: Yes, very much so. It's very international. Aidan: Right. Mary: We lived in the Italian part of town, um, there was like, there's like different ethnic neighborhood, it's very multicultural, multi-ethnic, always has been and it still is, but primarily now because its Quebec, there, the primary language there is first, French. So, if you don't know fluent French and fluent English, you cannot get a job. Aidan: Mm-hm, right, and, um, is, is there a sizable Greek community there too? Mary: Yes, there is a huge old Greek community there, with churches, with schools, very big, very, very big. Aidan: Okay, so you grew up in an environment where you did not feel-Mary: I didn't feel as a stranger, out of place. Yes, because when I first moved here, because I don't have straight blonde hair, I was like, always asked where am I from. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: To where in Canada, in Montreal, nobody asked you that. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: You know? Everyone was like, from somewhere, and um it was basically “how good is your French?” [laughs] Aidan: Right. Right, so, um, so yeah, wha wha, so what was, was there anything you noticed, like did you feel, in terms of your sense of feeling at home and feeling the sense of community, how, or were there any differences in how you felt about being in Greece versus the Greek community in Montreal? �6 Mary: Well that was when I was really young, there was a huge, the differences that I noticed the most was the differences between the Canadian, the Montreal Canadian communities to moving here, to Washington. My parents bought a house in Virgina, Vienna, Virginia, the subway then, it was 1980, it only went to Rosslyn, it was very isolating out in the suburbs, it was primarily white, um, it, we really felt like aliens. Aidan: Yeah. Mary: That was really, a lot harder than moving from Greece from a young age to Montreal, the hard part was that we moved from the country, that literally everything was open, there was like, uh, very, you know, very small buildings, it wasn't, you know, and then all of the sudden we moved to Montreal and here's this giant city, and there is giant buildings and skyscrapers and tons of traffic, so that was really shocking. Aidan: Right. Mary: That part, you know, to get, to get used to. Aidan: Yeah, okay, so now we’ll transition a little bit to um, I guess like the crux of this interview, um, how did you get to America? And that's kind of a broad question. You can interpret this a couple ways I guess. Mary: Mm-hm. Aidan: But in a broad sense, how did you get to America? Mary: Okay, um, at the time, because we were in high school my parents, there was three of, I had three siblings, my parents, and my three sibling--my two other siblings, so three kids, and I’m the oldest, and, um, my dad had gotten really tired, even though he loved Montreal, he had gotten tired of the cold winters, and it was hard on his body, and he started hating it. So, he decided to do a little tour in the US to visit friends and family, and he fell, he ended up coming, driving through Virginia in the spring, and everything had bloomed, and Washington was very beautiful with all the cherry blossoms, and he fell madly in love with the area. So he decided that this is where he wanted to move us all to. And so at the time he hired a lawyer, and um, they uh the lawyer got us green cards, uh, you know, resident alien cards, and we all moved here, that's how we moved, through my dad. So my dad was here for a couple of years, and he got all the paperwork done, and then he brought us, he brought the entire family here. Aidan: I see, so was that when you were, so you finished high school in Canada? Mary: Yes. And then I did three, uh, the four classes here to grad, to get also--I went to high school at Madison High in Virginia, uh, for the last year, for another year when we first moved here so I could get the equivalency to the diploma, to the high school diploma. �7 Aidan: Okay, I see, and then, um, after that, what did you do? When you were, when you were sort of, uh, when, I guess like when you-Mary: After high school? Aidan: After high school, and-Mary: After high school I took some classes at George Mason. I really didn't like being out in the suburbs, so I dropped the classes, and I wanted to move to DC, to Washington, to the city. And I decided that I really wanted to check out and see what it's like becoming a stylist, a hair stylist, so I apprenticed in a salon, and ended up really liking it and I stayed there, and I finished my apprenticeship, I did my exams, and I became a stylist. I got my license as a hairdresser, I loved it, and I moved into Washington. Aidan: Ah I see, ok so that was your first work experience here [in the United States]. Mary: Yes. Aidan: Okay, good, um, yeah, so one of the questions is what motivated or caused your move to the US, but I guess that we already covered that. Mary: Yes, it was my parents. Aidan: Yeah, okay. Mary: Yeah, it was the family. Aidan: But, um, I am curious about what you thought about it at the time, were you happy in Montreal? Or were you excited to move? Mary: I was very happy in Montreal, and it was a very horrible time moving here. Aidan: Okay. Mary: We had a very hard time adjusting, um, it was very alienating, it was very, very white, and even though we’re white Mediterraneans, we did not feel part of this, you know, American, white neighborhood that we moved into. Aidan: Right. Mary: Um, it was uh, we lived in the city so everybody used public transportation, we grew up with the public transportation in Montreal, which is fantastic, and then when we moved to the burbs unless you could drive, or someone was driving you somewhere, you were completely cut off. Aidan: Right. �8 Mary: And at that time, like I said, there was no Metro, there was no easy access to anything, so it was very alienating and very difficult. Aidan: Right, I see, so, so you were not so happy here when you first started? Mary: No. Aidan: Okay. Mary: No, I hated it. Aidan: Okay, yeah, um, I, I do have one interesting question: how did you meet your first friend in America? Mary: Oh my gosh. Uh-Aidan: If you can even remember, but-Mary: I can't even remember the first. So, I met a lot of, uh, people when I took the classes, um, you know, for the, to get my diploma, because there was, we were all seniors, so I met one of the first people that I remember, I met someone that their parents, their dad worked for the CIA that was never around, so that was a wild story. And she was great, and it was true, here dad was never around, and we became friends. And I met, I met quite a few folks in, I started meeting people in the high school, and people that were more from different places, people that had traveled a lot, or, you know, were not the cheerleaders and the jocks. But it was more like, and that was something else that was shocking to me was, like, having this world, like, all separate, where the school was like, it was like what they used to call it which I thought was really weird was like the jocks the cheerleaders and then the freaks. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: And so that was really wild. Because we never had that in Canada, our school didn't involve, either you were in sports or you were not, but it was not a big deal. It wasn't like a big, the Canad-- the American, the American upbringing to the high school was just kind of, it was just kind of very different. It was stuff that we saw on television. Aidan: Right. Mary: So, yeah, it was weird. Aidan: Right, right, okay, so, so it sounds like over time, at first at least it was difficult to find some sort of sense of community, did you ever really, I mean not necessarily in comparison to Greece or Montreal, which have large established communities. �9 Mary: Mm-hm. Aidan: But I guess a place like DC, which, um, which, um, according to the research that I did does not have a very large Greek population, [Greek] immigrant population. Mary: No. Aidan: Um, did you ever find any sort of community, or is it never really-Mary: Yes, I did, actually, I found a great community, uh, in music, um, I found a lot of friends, and it was um, very, very embracing, was the arts, the arts community, the musicians, the poets, um, the college students that were, um, politically motivated were the people that I was interested in, those kind of, those kind of folks. And there was a huge group back then, it wasn't, Washington isn't like it was now. It was pretty much offices, and then, either you worked in an office or you didn't, or you went to school, and then by like 5 o'clock in the afternoon they would roll up, literally, the sidewalks because the offices would close and it would be a dead town. There was nobody there. So, um, we didn't have, there was a lot of crime in Washington then, and it was also, um, a lot cheaper to live in DC than it is now, so there was a very, there was a lot of young people that lived in Washington, and I made a lot of friends, and roommates, through, you know, group houses and apartments and sort of-- And then it was also very cheap for the artsy communities, like um, the people that were in bands, and the people that were poets, and the people, uh, that wanted to show their art, there was a lot of really bad neighborhoods in Washington, with, with like, really not great buildings, so it was easy for all of us to see shows, and see events at places like that, it wasn't hard for people to play, like it is now. Like right now if you're not popular, or famous, uh, you can't get anything, a gig in a club. Aidan: Yeah, yeah. Mary: It's very limited, to where then, it was very open, and there was a lot of people that came from other places and other colleges, and other cities, like a lot of people would come down from Philadelphia, people would come from North Carolina, and there was a lot of stuff going on in Washington and it was a very embracing community. Aidan: Right, right. Mary: So, that's where I ended up getting very connected, and that's how I ended up staying here for a very long time. Aidan: Mm-hm, right. Mary: And I met my husband here, so we ended up making our home here. Aidan: Right. Mary: And, you know, family and that sort. �10 Aidan: So, I know that, um, I know that there is a large Greek orthodox community in general, like it, I think, um-Mary: Yes, there is. Aidan: Like many communities, especially diasporic communities, kind of connect a lot of the time through religion. Mary: Yes, they do. Aidan: This is, this is one of the questions my class was concerned with, is, um, um, sorry if it's a little bit abrupt-Mary: That's okay. Aidan: But just while we were on the topic of finding community, or finding fellow Greek immigrants, um, have you ever been involved with religion? Or has that ever played a part in your life, cause, because I know it can be very important in at least-Mary: Yes, in the Greek community, yes, yes, we’re, uh, most of the Greeks are Greek orthodox, they are very serious about their religion, they, uh, a lot of them connect through the church, uh, and the church of course, you know, you have to become a member, and that sort of thing. That was more my parents, uh, I would go to church periodically. The biggest holiday is Easter, it's bigger than Christmas, and so, the only time that I would really go to church was when my mom wanted me to go with her for the resurrection, uh, service, in, on Easter. And, uh, when I was little in Greece, we had a little village church of course and we went there on Sundays with our grandparents, but it was different, they were the ones that were very connected, I'm not very religious con-- very religiously connected so I’ve never, um, belonged to the church. Aidan: Mm-hm, okay, okay good, get that out of the way. Mary: Yes, but you have to be a member. Aidan: Right. Mary: It's like, you, I mean you can go to church on a Sunday, but to be involved in all their activities and all sort of, of that sort of thing is like you have to be a member of the church. Aidan: Okay, I see, I see. Um, so kind of back to just, like, the topic of like, kind of, as you, when you got here, were there any things you did that helped you sort of, um, grow your community? Grow like sort of grow into being in America, and did that affect the identity that you held important before, or like did that sort of, um, influence your beliefs, or values, or what you thought about yourself? �11 Mary: I feel, I feel like there was a big part of me that grew up here. So, I feel like a third, like, I'm a third Greek, I'm a third, um, part, you know, Canadian, and the other part is American. They had all, all those countries had a lot of influence in my life, and by the way I am today. Um, I, I didn’t, I was looking more, I didn't, wasn't really looking for Greek communities when I moved here. I was looking more for real people. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: And more, not so, I don't know, broken up, you know, in groups, in like, you know, the Virginia, the whites and this and whatever. So no, I didn't really look for a Greek community. I knew that the Greek community here was many generations. A lot of them were not like the Greek community that was in Canada where they, where the families had just migrated, you know, they were the first generation, their parents, and the children was the second. So, here, most of the Greeks that I did meet, they didn't speak the language, they were very far removed from Greece, I mean, they would go there for holidays but that was pretty much it, so, it wasn't the same, but I have a big, huge family, so that part kept me much more connected. Aidan: Mm-hm, Okay right. Mary: Than the church would. Aidan: Than the church per-se? Okay. Mary: Yes. Aidan: I see. And um, could you just tell me about some of the things that you did, um, when you were, I guess like younger in DC, when you, when you moved there, um, what were you up to, besides, were you doing anything besides being a stylist? Or was it stylist full time? Mary: I was working as a stylist full time because I was, uh, living on my own, and I was supporting myself. And, I got, I was very politically, I got very politically involved, and I still am, um, women’s rights. Pro-choice, pro-vote, pro freedom, pro-everything. Uh, I've always been a Democrat, a die-hard Democrat. Um, for me a lot of my connections with people have been political connections, much more than religious, or you know, or you know, background, or you know, coming from the same country. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: I started by getting really involved in, also in music, I really loved, I met my husband then. And then I met a bunch of friends, everybody was young, everybody was going to American University, there was a huge, uh, a huge music scene there, everybody was doing punk stuff, and fun stuff, and there was a lot of music coming in from California, from England, um, there was a lot of poetry, there was a lot of, there was a lot going on, so I got super involved with all that. Aidan: Mm-hm, right, okay, so-- �12 Mary: And I also loved to travel, so, I got very involved in, like, traveling, like as much as I could. Aidan: So through these, through these, um, sort of like, very politically active communities, did you sort of, I don't know, I guess, I guess, okay, let me preface this by asking the question: what was your opinion of America before you immigrated? What were, what were, what did you know about it, and how did you feel about it? Did you, did you, believe that it was a land of opportunity? Or did you believe that it was just the neighbor of Canada? Or did, you know, did you have any opinions on it? Mary: I, my opinion was, uh, because I hadn't been here before, only a visit to see family for, for a wedding when I was young, in New York, um, my, my thoughts about America was mostly what television showed us, certain TV shows, and how things are here, and sort of like, you know, television played a lot, movies played a lot, so, you know, sort of like, Happy Days, and uh, stuff like that, um, when I, um, I was not excited to move here because I loved living in Canada, and I was leaving behind my life and my friends, and that was devastating, um. I didn't really, I didn't like American when I first moved here. The violence really scared me. Um, the health care was terrifying, because the funny thing was when we first moved here, you know, we have social medicine in Canada, so when we first moved here, I remember, it was my brother, I think, got bronchitis in the winter, and my mom took him to the clinic, and when she walked out of the clinic they gave her a bill for like 400 dollars which totally freaked her out, because um you realize right there and then, that it's completely different. That when you’re sick you just can't go into the clinic and get medicine, you have to have money, and you have to have, uh, insurance. And that was like, really a hard awakening to see how expensive and how difficult health care is in America. Aidan: Right. Mary: So, I fell in love with America very slowly. And I still think if I had not lived here for as long as I have, and have family and friends that are American, that I probably would not like this country very much. It’s very racist, and the racism is deep, and scary, and it's always, I've always seen it since I moved here in 1980 to today. Um, it's, um, it’s not fair in so many ways. And it’s, uh, and right now the way it's changed, it's frightening, it's frightening. So, it's a place that I love, but I'm really scared of it at the same time. Aidan: I see. So, so you are, um, so, your opinion of America, I guess, like, you were never surprised by- because I think there's a common experience of people thinking America is this very free, very liberated place, and then coming to America and kind of, like you said, suffering this like rude awakening. So, are you, are you sort of saying that even before you came to America, you kind of, there was, there was no enchantment that was undone when you got here. Mary: No. Aidan: Okay, I see. Mary: No. �13 Aidan: Yeah. Mary: It was, what was frightening moving here was, how, well, also of course where we moved to, you know, Vienna, Virginia. How, how scary and, and white it was. And how, and how, there was a funny story we got when we first moved in, we got the lady, the neighbor, showed up with a basket full of fruit and cookies, it was a welcome, a neighborhood welcome wagon, and my mother invited her in, and, you know, she offered her Greek cookies, because were Greek, and she also offered her Greek coffee. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: And, so, the neighbor had never had Greek coffee which is very, which is ground very fine, and it’s, um, it’s quite strong, it's got a lot of caffeine, so the, the woman said that she would love to have some, and my mother made her some coffee and she stayed and we chatted for a little bit, and then the next day she came back knocking on our door, wanting to see the package that the coffee came in because she couldn't sleep at all the night before, and she was, um, she was a little upset, and kind of, like, made us feel that we, you know, my mom felt terrible, because she was like, you know, this is just coffee, was trying to explain to her that it had a lot of caffeine, that's probably why she couldn't sleep. But it just made us, did not make us feel very welcome, her attitude. So, it was, it was difficult, it was a difficult time for us because, um, family would come and visit us, and at the time, all my uncles at the time, drove black Cadillacs, and when they showed up, uh, people were like kind of afraid, they thought like “what is up with you guys,” you know, “where are you from?” And it was strange, you know, so it was like, it was just kind of, like, it felt like if you didn't fit in, you just weren't part of that, that area, you know, if you didn't have a at that time, you know, the kids all in school had, the guys had pickup trucks, and the people, the girls had little cars, and if you didn't have a car, you know, you just didn't, it was, it was a very different time, very different time. I was never, I had never gone to a party that was in a big open farm field, where they had watermelon, you know, stuffed with moonshine, which I didn't know, and I got deathly ill. So, there was a lot of different things that I was trying to sort of see if I can fit in or acclimate with all of it, and it kind of was like, it was strange, looking at it back now, it was a little, it was strange, it was strange. Aidan: Yeah, so, speaking more about these feelings of sort of alienation, um, did you feel that it, it got better once you moved to DC? Mary: Absolutely. It was like day and night. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: I’ve met so many cool folks, and, um, it was, that's why I fell in love with this area. I met a lot of folks that felt like me, I met a lot of folks that were really interesting, and uh it wasn't like this tiny little world that was out in the suburbs. And, uh, we felt like, you know, we were, we, we marched for the, all the pro-choice marches, we, we marched for a lot, and we were very united, and people would come from all over the states and stay at our group houses, and we'd make flyers because at the time technology was very different, it wasn't really happening. So there was a very big connection, and, and opened my vision �14 to the Americ-- to the Americas, not just this particular little area where it’s like, Virginia and DC. Like, there's all the Americans that are from like, all over. Aidan: Right. Mary: And then I started traveling, you know, and [the] West Coast was gorgeous that I fell in love with, and I was gonna move out there, but at the time it was really, it was hard, so we didn’t have a lot of friends there. I fell madly in love with the West Coa-- I mean, so I'm a big city person, but I also like the country, but I saw America much more. [The interview was conducted in Mary’s kitchen, and her dog, Archer, was laying on the ground right next to us for most of the interview. Her husband, Ben, my uncle, is also on the computer in the other room, and can be heard once or twice] Mary: Sorry about my whiney doggy [in response to dog making noise]. Aidan: He's okay. Okay, so, um, yeah, one more, so, so I guess to some extent would you say that it was not that you found people who were similar; you didn't find a community of people who had similar backgrounds to you, but you found a community in people where that background was not so important. [More dog noises] Mary: Exactly. And they all had different backgrounds, so it was interesting, it was very interesting to get to know each other, but yes, absolutely. Aidan: And have you, um, so, being of an immigrant community yourself, have you, do you think the fact that you immigrated here has created any unique interactions with the pre-existing immigrant communities in DC? Mary: I don't know about that. I don't know, I have not, I don't know. I, I have found that the stories that I've heard of people immigrating to the US, a lot of them have been really, really tough. And mine was a lot lighter than most, because of my parents. Aidan: Yeah. Mary: I was really lucky that my dad came here, he hired, you know, he hired a lawyer, we got our cards. It wasn't like hardship like a lot of people have had, where they haven't seen their families for a long time, um, you know, it was, it was expensive to get all that done and at the time my dad was working, he was much younger, and it worked out really well for us. So that was a big plus. So, I’ve heard more, I’ve heard stories of people having it a lot worse than me. I mean, I basically didn't like moving here and I had to acclimate, but then the paperwork, I didn't have to suffer like others have. Aidan: Right. Mary: You know, I was lucky with my dad. �15 Aidan: Right. Um, so, what do you think it means to really be American? Like what does, what does that mean to you, I guess? Mary: Well, I'm about to put in my paperwork to get my, uh, after much thought, to put in my paperwork to become an American citizen. So for me, I want to be able to vote, that's the most important thing on the planet, and that's the part that really has always bummed me out for not being an American citizen, because I’m very vocal about how I feel, about the politics, and about who I support, and, uh, what I support. And so I feel because I've spent so much time here and it's become my home, it's time for me to become an American citizen. So, maybe I can make my voice with my vote heard a little bit more, you know. I'm also getting older, and I have no plans to move back to Canada, I pretty much have made my, my, uh, life here, so I am gonna become an American citizen. Aidan: I see. And do you, do you think that that is, how do you think you would have reacted to that information 20 years ago? Mary: I would have been “no way,” you know? I'm kinda shocked at this new older me. But at the same time, I have no regrets, and I'm always gonna be a Canadian citizen because I was born there. But also because I've worked all my life here; this is where I've paid all my taxes, this is where I have my house, and my life, and my family is around. So, I think it's time for me to do it, and not, and not be afraid of doing it, or, you know, I'm not gonna change my mind. [Mary gets up at this point to heat up food for her dog, and the microwave can be heard very slightly in the background] Aidan: Okay. Mary: Hold on one second. [She is feeding her dog] Aidan: No problem, take your time. Mary: So yes. Aidan: Yeah, so, I guess kind of circling back to the, um, the sense of Greekness in your life, um, has that, do you think that you have like-- Well, are there things that you did, that you were able to do in Canada relating to your Greek heritage that you are not able to do here? Or are there things you're able to do here that you were not able to do in Canada? In terms of just like, expression of culture, or interacting with your culture. Mary: Yes. Well, Canada has a huge community there, so, you know, for instance going to the mar-Greek markets or the Greek cafés, and, uh, they also have their own music sta-- they have their own radio stations, and TV stations. So there's none of that here. And New York has more a lot of it, but here, no. So, I do miss that, I miss the cuisine, the food is fantastic. �16 Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: Much better than here, um, much better than here. So, I miss that. [Pouring dog food] But, um, I do miss, I do miss with Greece, I miss the, I miss the country itself very much because it’s so beautiful there, and I miss my, my relatives are getting very old, and so it's tough. I need to go back and visit them because time is going by very quickly. Aidan: Right, um, do you think that, do you think that your sense of culture has changed at all since being in America? Your sense of like, what culture you identify most strongly with? Mary: Well, you know, it's really kind of funny because we grew up all our lives calling ourselves Greek-Canadians, so even though I'm not a Greek citizen, I’ve always identified by being Greek first, because of my heritage. And then Canadian because of where I was born. Aidan: Right. Mary: So, I always have felt that I’m always Greek first. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: Because um I guess with my language and my coming, being raised with my grandparents when I was little, I definitely, I have a connection to there when I was a little girl. Aidan: Right. So, so, um, you grew up speaking, just to clarify, you grew up, Greek was your first language, right? Mary: Yes. Aidan: Okay. Okay, right, right, right. Mary: And then it was Greek and English. Aidan: Greek and English, right. Okay. Mary: And then we had to take French, but French I just sort of gave up on it. Aidan: Yeah? Mary: Because it was just more like I was angry about everything we had to do, and then when Montreal was sort of breaking up, it was just forced so much on us, and there was just, it just made me react in a negative way, not really embracing it, which was really dumb. Aidan: Interesting, well do you think that, um, in a similar way to the way the French language was kind of forced on the English-speaking citizens of Qu—Quebec-- �17 Mary: Absolutely! Aidan: Is that simil-- but is that similar, is that similar at all to the way you think, like, to the way, I guess like, like you said the alienation, like the pressure to conform to like the jocks and cheerleaders society. Were there, did you feel any, like, similarities between the pressure to conform to American society, and the pressure to conform to the French language the [Quebecois] French society? Mary: The French side? Yes, yes, it was very difficult, Quebec, yes. It became very, very difficult. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: Because if you weren’t fluent in French, you couldn't get a job, you couldn't do anything. Aidan: Right. Mary: So, it was starting to limit everything, there was like no freedom. To where, that's why everybody left, because parents did not have choices. Before, they had a choice whether to send their kid to an allEnglish school or an all-French school. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: But once it changed, you didn't have that choice, you had to go to an all-French school. Aidan: Right. Mary: And it was French Canadian. Aidan: Right, right, right. Mary: So, it was, it was tough, yes, it was really tough to be able to like, juggle all of it. Aidan: I see, but was that, is that, um, is that reminiscent of what you experienced when you came to America as well? Of just kind of like, kind of-Mary: Yes! Aidan: [that] it's easier to-Mary: Looking at it now, you know, you’re asking me that, yes. I totally, I totally felt like, yeah, there was another group you needed to be accepted by. Aidan: Mm-hm. �18 Mary: You know? And not feel like, not be asked all the time “where are you from.” And so, uh-Aidan: So, so when people ask you where you're from-- [slight interruption] Mary: [Gesturing to be quiet] Aidan: [Speaking to someone else] Don't worry, it's okay. [Speaking to Mary] Um, So, yeah, just like these little things like, um, you know, like, um, small, I guess did you experience any feeling of rejection when you came to America? Just like, like, you kind of talked about small things like the coffee, um, the neighbor coming over for coffee and being like “this is weird coffee what did you give me,” kind of like, not being very respectful, and even being a little skeptical. Mary: Yes. Aidan: In a way that you were made to feel bad even though what they did is, you know? Mary: Yes, they made us feel that we were like, weird, that we were like, weird foreigners. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: And not trusting, even though my mother was very welcoming. And you know, when she asked to see the package, we actually, my sister and I, sort of made fun of my mom at the time, and we were like “you know, don't, you know, don't, this is a whole different world Mama,” you know? Aidan: Yeah. Mary: It was like, you know, “don’t make your Greek coffee,” and she was like, totally shocked. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: Because, you know, it was, it was true! It was like this woman did not know and she thought that my mom, I don't know, had put something in the coffee. Aidan: Had poisoned her? Mary: Interpreted it in a totally different way. You know? Aidan: Yeah. Mary: So that was a little hard. That was a little hard. Aidan: Did you find a lot of those misinterpretations, or like, things, like you, I guess, previously at home, things you considered to be culturally significant to you, expressing them was more difficult in America? �19 Mary: Yes, well, yes because everybody where I, where, where we migrated to was [from] a very, very white area. And, um, they were very prejudiced. Like I said, if you weren't American, and you didn't have, and I didn’t have straight hair, I had curly hair, and I didn’t have a button nose and you know, whatever. So, we were considered, you know, foreigners. And so that was really strange because I wasn't, because I never knew that I was, in Canada, I never felt like that. Because everyone had different backgrounds like all my friends that I had in school, so their parents were from, like, different parts of Europe. And they were all like me, you know, they had like spoke English, they, you know, we were the first generations, so there wasn't like, “where are you from,” it was more like, “hey,” you know, “my mother makes this kind of food and we make this kind of food why don't you come over and taste it?” You know, kind of thing. Aidan: Um, could you maybe talk about a few, if you have any just examples of things that you thought were culturally significant to you, that were kind of like you felt like you had to suppress as a result of being in America? If you can think of anything, if you can't, it's no problem. Mary: If I can think of anything? No, not really. Aidan: I think the coffee is a good example. Mary: Well, the coffee, well you mean the neighbor, yes, that was weird, that was back then, yes, um, and them thinking that we were also in the Mafia was also, you know, because of the cars. Aidan: Yeah, yeah. Mary: That was also a bit weird, um. You know? I didn't, um, after high school I didn't spend any really much time there, so it was like I didn't want that part of the world, you know, so, I didn't, I didn’t engage in it, you know, that's why I fell in love with moving to DC and meeting all these different people, and so, yeah, I was like, I didn't look, I haven't looked back. And I’m glad I still, I live in Takoma Park now. But yeah, no. That's pretty much all I can remember. Aidan: Okay, okay, I see. Are there a lot of things you miss from Canada? Besides like, um, I guess besides like, more, uh, systemic things like governmental systems, uh, are there things like? Mary: Oh, I miss the food. Montreal has fantastic food, and, um, it’s like I said, multiethnic, so whatever neighborhood you go to, it's amazing food. You know, the Portuguese neighborhood has the most fantastic Portuguese food, the Greeks do, the Italians, it's like, very multi. And they really take, I mean, the food there is phenomenal, so I miss the food. I don't miss the winter. And I miss, um, I miss my family there, and it's a, it's a fun city, it's a really fun city, so, when I go visit, like, I knew from a long time ago I couldn't really move back to Montreal, because I would have to like really dive into French, and really change a lot where I was just sort of like, I wasn't ready to move back into the cold weather either. I mean if it was Vancouver? Maybe it would have been a different story. [laughs] But Montreal, I realized a long time ago that even though I love the city, I just couldn't move back there and work, it was just the winters are too brutal, [I] couldn't deal with it, the winter. �20 Aidan: I see, so it kind of kept you away? Mary: Mm-hm. Aidan: I see. Yeah-Mary: The winters and having to be fluent in French. Aidan: Right, okay. I see, um, okay, I have another interesting question about uh Montreal, so, um, it sounds like, yeah, a very multiethnic city, very multicultural city, with a lot of different, uh, groups. A lot of different groups of first-generation immigrants, of countries that might have their respective turmoils with each other in Europe. Um, did that extend to the immigrant communities in your experience? Or was it kind of like they came together, they, they maintained a degree of separation and a degree of uniqueness due to their heritage, and, and being in touch with this heritage, but also kind of were, um, joined under being Canadian at the same time? Mary: I, I did not, I did not notice prejudices. I think, um my family didn't have any, I mean, we didn't, I mean, we grew up in an Italian neighborhood, loved all the neighbors, loved our Italian stores I remember. We knew each and everybody knew us kids, we could go in and out. Um, no, I don't remember, I don't remember the, any prejudices there. I don't remember that there, there wasn't, I didn’t notice any of that. What I noticed was the racist, the racists here. The racist comments-Aidan: Yeah. Mary: The, and not just about me, but people of color. Um, it was very uncom-- it is very uncomfortable still, and it was just, I noticed that a lot here in the States. Because also, our black communities in Montreal, they're all, uh, they are African communities, French African speaking communities. Because it is Quebec, they bring a lot of immigrants in from the French-speaking part of Africa. So, coming here was a different cultures, whole different cultures of the African communities in Montreal, to the African Americans in the US, very different people. Aidan: Right. Mary: So, and very different history of course. And so, yeah, that was a bit different, that was very different um. But I think, I think also because of, like, all I can remember is because of television uh, the US is portrayed as like, this glamorous, you know, more then than I think it is now, you know? And I know, well, the other thing is, people that are starving and people that don't have anything, when they see how much we waste here, I mean, it all, even if you look at like how much we wasted in the beginning of the [COVID-19] vaccines, because some of the people were not the right age or maybe they were a few years off, or maybe they weren't actively on chemo, or whatever, they got refused the vaccine and the vaccines got thrown out, we wasted so many vaccines to where other countries, they didn't even get a chance! They didn't even have enough vaccines for their medical people! And so, when you look at how much, the gluttonous that we have here, it's a little rough. �21 Aidan: Yeah. Mary: Like I remember when one of my cousins said, when they came for the first time to the US to visit, and I said, well, “how, what was your experience like?” Because they, they were in New York, and they said, “what I noticed is that the homeless people in the US have really expensive sneakers,” to where on, to where the homeless people that we have in Europe, they have no shoes on their feet at all. So, there's just like, stuff that you notice that, you know, we have and then we don't have. You know? Like how can we have so many young children today that are not getting any meals? They are not getting any, they are not getting any nutrition? How can we-- and then we’re wasting a lot of food at the same time. Aidan: Yeah. Mary: So, it's kind of it, its, that stuff is scary, and, and makes me unhappy. And I hope that more future generations can do better things than we have. Aidan: Do you think that that culture, I guess like, overconsumption, consumer culture, do you think that is like a uniquely American phenomenon? Or do you-Mary: Yes. Aidan: Or do you think that it's just like, especially-Mary: No, I think of it as an American, uniquely American phenomenon, where we feel like, you know, we've got to, we can have this and we can have more, we need more, and we aren't really nice to each other. We don't really, you know, I, I find it, yes, I find it very greedy sometimes, and very, not very caring. Yeah, overabundance. Aidan: Okay, yeah, and, and as someone who was educated outside of the US, did you find that, um, from since you got here to even now, do you think there is an um, do you think that there is a uniquely American mindset that is taught? Do you think that there is like, that there are people who are kind of like, willing to defend things like overconsumption because it’s, like, “the American way” quote, unquote. Have you met a lot of these people? Mary: Mmm no, but I see, I mean, I see what's going on. The people that I know, they are not like that, but that's a very small, closed circle of friends of mine. But the overconsumption in this country is ridiculous. And we are, we are terrible! I mean, yes, we are a big factor of destroying the planet. So, we have a lot going on, we have a lot that we need to work on, but I also find that as a country there is always the other side, there is always a side that listens, that cares… that is trying to do something. For as much as right now, the ugly side has such a loud voice that it tries to like, drown everything out, to where it makes everybody feel sad and broken. To where there is a whole other side, I feel like, of people that are caring, and that are trying to do the best that they can. �22 Aidan: Mm-hm, yeah. So, I guess like, so we have about ten minutes left, and just to kind of close out, um, I want to ask a kind of broad question. Is there anything that you, I guess like, not have come to appreciate, well, we can talk about things, I guess we can start by: is there anything that like, because you said that when you first got here you did not like it very much, that you kind of grown to love it over time? Are there any things in particular that you have grown to appreciate over time about America, or have grown to, I guess, like is there anything that has grown on you in a way that you didn't expect? Mary: Um, what’s grown on me that I didn't expect was the understanding and love that I have for the people in the country. Because I've lived here. Because watching it, watching, watching America on the news in another country, like Canada, which is where I would have been if we hadn't moved here, uh, it's very, it is very scary. And so, I think what’s changed for me is that, I do kind of understand how it runs, that's why I said, you know, I see that the racist ticket in America is very deep, it didn't just start yesterday. I feel like there is a lot of work that needs to be done, but at the same time, I feel like we can move on, we can show the world, because everyone is counting on us, on this country, to show the light, and then democracy, I think we can do it if we fight hard enough for it. Aidan: Mm-hm, yeah, so, so to get a little more specific, I guess, are there any things, like, about America, so, so that's, okay, so like talking about political activism-Mary: America. Well, yeah. I would, I would want it, I would want to figure out something to do with healthcare. I mean, the saddest part of this country, and right now for me too because I'm working for my insurance, is like, how much we all pay, and how much we’re slaves to the insurance companies. Aidan: Mm-hm. Mary: And how much, the very scary part of this country, besides all the gun violence, which is completely insane, is the fact that we don’t show a lot of appreciation about our people here, we don't take care of them. You know, health care is horrible, they are constantly trying to scare people, cutting Medicare, people that can't afford to get health care. We've lost friends because it was too late by the time they got health care because they were ill. And so, to me, it's, uh, that's the part that's like very, you know, when I think about Canada versus here, I think about health care. I think to where like everybody should have access to health care. And then if you want to pay for more, then that's an individual right, just like they have in Canada. If you want to pay privately you can pay out of pocket, but that doesn't mean you've got to sit around and be sick forever, and by the time you get screened, there's not, you've got some, you know, terrible disease, and there's nothing you can do because you didn't have insurance for years. And that's a very sad story in this country, and that's what breaks my heart, and that's what I hope really changes also, it's very big for me is the health care here. Aidan: Right, so, to sort of conclude, um, are there any things, I guess that you find that you prefer from living in America? Mary: Umm. [laughter] Aidan: It can be really, it can be really anything, it can be like cultural, or it can be anything. �23 Mary: Well, what I love about living here right now, is that I’m really happy that I didn't have a heavy winter. I mean I got to tell you guys, if you haven’t lived in Canada, Montreal, uh, 37 below the wind chill factor to 40, it is nasty. And so, I love the weather here, I love the seasons, well, it's getting a little funky, but I do love the fact that it was not a heavy winter. I do feel bad about the microclimate stuff. Um, I've gotten, I'm very close to my immediate family and I love having them around, so that's a huge factor, over the years how we've all been close, it would be hard for me to move away. There’s a lot of great stuff about America, there is, you know, we have the right to speak our mind, freedom of speech, you know? We have a lot of freedom, and we need to use it, and, um, and I think I love this country enough to fight for it. And that's why I want to become an American citizen, I want to be able to vote. That's a huge, huge factor for me because I think it's the best way my voice can be heard. Aidan: Yeah. Let’s just see. Okay, um, I guess we're about at the hour mark, um, I've asked pretty much all the questions I wanted to cover. My final question is: do you have any questions for me, or anything you'd like to add? Or anything you’d like to discuss before we finish? Mary: Um, the um, uh, well-- is, because you’re very aware of what's going on [dog barking] with migration, I'm just curious to find out what you're finding out, like, what is happening with immigration in the United States? And, and with uh, you know, people, how, how difficult it is for people to get in to become citizens or residents of this country? Aidan: Well yeah, of course it's getting more difficult all the time. Mary: Mm-hm. Aidan: Depends on, I mean, yeah, It kind of depends on, um I guess who’s in office. Mary: Right. Aidan: But clearly, um, I mean, immigration, immigrants are becoming more and more a topic of conversation in America I think, um, I mean America is a nation of immigrants, at the end of the day. And I think that a lot of people do not necessarily respect that fact. Mary: Yes. Aidan: Yeah. Um, but yeah, is there anything else you’d like to add? Or anything you’d like to, to say? To tell me? Mary: Um, no! I thought that uh your questions, it brought back a lot of memories, um, I sort of feel, I sort of felt at first that, that I just, you know, that maybe you need to talk to someone that was like, had a rough time coming into the country, but I think there's just so many different stories. Aidan: Yeah! �24 Mary: I think that everyone has a different story, and everyone that comes here, uh, wants to have an opportunity to be accepted, and be able to get a job, and show how much, what they can do. That's, the immigrants that I've spoken to, they're all about making a better life, better education for their families, for their children, and, um, and trying to make sure that the crazy MAGA doesn't get into office again, because that would be terrifying. Aidan: Yeah. Mary: And so, I'm hoping that the American people can show that democracy still stands strong. That's one of my biggest, um, hopes and prayers for right now. Aidan: Yeah. Mary: That's about it. Aidan: Okay, perfect! Alright, uh, I think I'm supposed to say something at the end, but I can't remember. Uh no, I think that's everything. Thank you so much! Mary: My pleasure. Aidan: Alright, I'll end it now. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Spring 2023 Interviews Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Aidan Lambiotte Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Mary Tsiolas Location The location of the interview Takoma Park, Maryland Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview with Mary Tsiolas Description An account of the resource This interview is between Aidan Lambiotte and his aunt, Mary Tsiolis, a Greek Canadian immigrant to the United States. As the daughter of Greek immigrants to Quebec, Mary depicts her early childhood, and experiences growing up in both Greece and Monrtréal during the 1960s - 1970s. She draws stark contrasts between her experiences in Canada and her initial time as an immigrant in America, touching heavily on the themes of isolation, microaggression, and white suburban hegemony in the United States. She ultimately uses her experiences to illustrate the manner in which she found community in the DC area, entirely outside of Greek or Canadian culture, as well as her love-hate relationship with American identity. This interview was conducted as part of an undergraduate final project for the University of Maryland, College Park course HIST 428M (Spring 2023). This course was led by Professor Anne Rush of the Department of History, College of Arts and Humanities, and was sponsored by the Center for Global Migration Studies. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Aidan Lambiotte Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Center for Global Migration Studies Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource March 6th, 2023 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource The full rights of this oral history interview were given by the interviewee to the University of Maryland, College Park. This interview may be quoted from, published, or broadcast in any medium that the University of Maryland, College Park shall deem appropriate. Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Canada community Greece health care music politics https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/2df7386ea8ab6e117be4dafcb2f229a8.jpg?Expires=1785369600&Signature=TsQ0PwgyzML0IWWfyX9jbgrp%7E56JF5nNM8GoBpENA8opyYB7mO-zFFtBQ7QlW-XZqS9mNPtQ5PFFym1oY%7EwZPlLbjgbYOnpvxlCkRMHoK9ZdXqZNlZVGp3kditJxpcOHu7S2AHKr57N9NYun-r4jVoiYUl9wsHFyknR5xu9i6Lii5Om7Gf8hptXbFTuB5mOi8qkL4PheL4xZO2UW2yhq-wOOufFEdLRECI2kEcWVzHvFZQwARDeYWpoBtzBVSoHU8IrcsBU6Y77z1gnOhPGkgH6f-JoIEi5ntrfJFyhNIckyMrbgHYDdq6B0eIfvrjVmKwlPOvApQE0eKIO4hdODiQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 7436580fd9fa7e165c8dfe1634f6bf28 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/26d91a2ee087738bdb13058f111cfcd3.mp3?Expires=1785369600&Signature=Cvyj176Ri3jDep5foHA0eA9lph%7E5ELq1AFnF0Y6IFYnI7Q4Sdrsc0DF-lQqhhV2ses0wJZ-1hLETImS1PQFhell6lgzxH93RJn2ym611ezCwhWeMQjB52aXs3ukFe6S6zF2sLsbmY6mFOthUtmA%7ETL3BPQu9ARbGx6oWa0q-rizMF3jJYngBxDIu0zAc-nGsXp-5OgVEK-4RQcLsPtgyWUPVAB281F36sx-1g-cg2R%7EOYNamU1%7EX47tWLqnxZHTPdrTZuk0P4%7EkLBn2LJs6AVNobf0aKp2252aWOOh-eGDC4pvrNPkfhRfzsj7EK6XzQOwPeESSbKA0jeegr03dmqw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 2786e30217f5f73fb7c2a77ca9058ce2 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/88d6db2b90edbeec7464a5e1876807b8.pdf?Expires=1785369600&Signature=SHb%7ExJKUBNjwTG1%7EDcMzBZGe0MpF97L%7EuHYem%7EXwaYYqrqO1zWYG0vrGfYmL1CSDaslrlazuUZMn0TLeOeDhjuPwjO59s8TBO9NH5jMtSDuWZ05wmuysS8YtZcRx9%7ETm0TNqEjlNiAUDKmT2C6XxpxFnjHo7GD8-mrAF8qWpIoTFiBpRLfzzbzeNL-GRIGBp7ZjVY5FvzcJMQMBm5c6loSsL7tnvdzdUMD5CFHRrfAmYTRPY87b6VgfSzH-2f4LLBvq030yY91yR6lhgvHCTwfAQnk%7Ecgyt0CHljDV8le6gilw8kyDq-3pgCAGyPgCnpHoV0BUUa35XzZRoXUv1yiw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 58d19f6b93872c73afca7e207e0306a4 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Carlos Morales Interview Transcript (Spanish) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource May 2014 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/afdb4060988eac2ff50bcc72a6afb41f.pdf?Expires=1785369600&Signature=t-FtxslF9t1ke7mAisPY8v76DMmZ-25vqCbdr667ssmam4mRWrctuUiVeTGLmKXi7IEAHBIG07ZVA1mFj5WeSPcnraiePiMF1EQAHC7t6XTtLyPlM30zhi1aar55DsgUKOuiD8ReZOSSWHqdos34yssEIeeRyOpa6UBZuv8JZoX3nH4UeMwPYh7WogjyrVWlm6UOAUYEaHbHQ%7Ejyqv0Ug%7E-8BFzJ6Hbp7m9aWho0WWhDf98h70bCKBFi%7E8waqCmg-KeI6wxZ90vkOmzbhoyTx23xgz-yM513M8B3Ftpn3GYKIdJl955ad%7EGPbSxj76TiVkubtjlKMmkDi3K40MAeEQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 495ca909d642e5d74525eb285f4e733f Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Carlos Morales Interview Transcript (English) Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Spring 2014 Interviews Description An account of the resource These interviews were conducted as part of an undergraduate final project for the University of Maryland, College Park course HIST 428N (Spring 2014). This course was led by Professor Thomas Castillo of the History Department, College of Arts and Humanities, and was sponsored by the Center for Global Migration Studies (formerly the Center for the History of the New America). These were part of the original series of online oral histories the Center gathered. Therefore, the transcripts appear different than that of later interviews. Additionally, many of these interviews were also filmed. Please contact us for access to available video files. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Center for Global Migration Studies (formerly The Center for the History of the New America) Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource Spring 2014 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource The full rights of these oral history interviews were given by the interviewees to the University of Maryland, College Park. These interviews may be quoted from, published, or broadcast in any medium that the University of Maryland, College Park shall deem appropriate. Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Monica Morales Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Carlos Morales Location The location of the interview College Park, Maryland Duration Length of time involved (seconds, minutes, hours, days, class periods, etc.) 21:38 Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview of Carlos Morales Description An account of the resource This oral history interview is of Carlos Morales, the father of the interviewer, Monica Morales. Carlos immigrated to the United States in the 1980s from El Salvador. Source A related resource from which the described resource is derived This interview was conducted as part of an undergraduate final project for the University of Maryland, College Park course HIST428N Immigrant Life Stories: An Oral History Practicum (spring 2014). This course was led by Professor Thomas A. Castillo of the History Department, College of Arts and Humanities, and was sponsored by the Center for the New America. Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Center for the History of the New America Date A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource May 2014 Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource The full rights of this oral history interview were given by the interviewee to the University of Maryland, College Park. This interview may be quoted from, published, or broadcast in any medium that the University of Maryland, College Park shall deem appropriate. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource Audio file with ID3 version 2.3.0, contains: MPEG ADTS, layer III, v1, 128 kbps, 44.1 kHz, Monaural Language A language of the resource English, Spanish Canada Central America Chula Vista civil war El Salvador Guadalajara Guatemala Mexico migrant revolution Tijuana