https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/4a2d9e875fd104da6256fd4eb88981e3.png?Expires=1779321600&Signature=I9XtlsL9vI7GSJ1L0P7JdKFMqu1tM1zZ1NYZaG5lo8FL9myi7KG49u6GIRVkG6qK7wNvhQGLZu2eV5f7WqiO-Kb%7EpMNfP-Xv6y59KeSYnOe-qojd0W3tG6MHSSVIHQ4WczxGK7ajGsked8spaBZ4YmxirTkFdSb9B6xnvcsNPfLov6KYZ1zTn%7E-Ns2%7EoxlNN-Kj2zWSEodZpK5SWKQEfMlQAbjJo2n2UzerzAWforGv4Ni6daS83uVArAOtfSS%7EcPgtOUgiv7BGZ2roJgj0iS0EYNa7n84Pml40eg3iq0Qx0YhKyunQMrdZha%7EgUkNrVLNcUVyd07JoNckHK8JdmGQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 6147894ad22328604a02f7e8ed554f7b https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/7070aee80ef97c39565f505e41899703.png?Expires=1779321600&Signature=hEc4k%7EhMzLt8e7r7IH7Q7-hYb%7Es6UcJHX7tzIjH%7EA-4YDE6FT02I9XGm-cwVqIcLso0RcR6DZtgspRoGNeyfcBJmXluuW59CUfOcAguOz3iaNUfF10QPVs98gbMC2ezHrf3QnanKmfAGgJsoKHsGHj6rrZTJ6V1YpcsLuQVvfr56yZNQXHh1W%7E7uG6cc%7EsMKVWWm%7EuXqJ0aBLV7dqMvRf5UETj%7ERXxJNwfvaa8YS7XI6CAOZlBmlxTi-4zxLGWmYimdU5tR2lgnKfpj56n4AMfnBJzBkGCcvM6sw7wIYZiznCp7Cu47fcYTDbhyQRzBHrgNh2leEQThYV5LES%7EtvOw__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 3c716310d12b0ca10878c8a3bde68026 https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/4a892d9388631515563fefe127a0c9f5.mp3?Expires=1779321600&Signature=trtzPrwetEG-q1Ol3EMl70HMmEKGrzEdau14NF-I4dsFF9zOkSEHExO0yTqyy0nYKdFGLCV84OpAiKaJLomWLTIFHvOwM%7E2kkLpDH1Skkk-LyR4zctSpLHFoQf9jni3Mg%7ES9Ogl9mGhKM-puFju9TheDSEKafbDNkZmqAYSXyRqR2ynCV5YA3e8SiyTMWsOf65LGnKRtQ45tmVwvJMgLxO8Gya%7EmDzaQdZQajwBJTwdcIkJfS4dZ4XZb1J%7EnUIuqeOvE01LDmDh%7ElH8OS1AhcXgFd7XyfoWF-SvWI8Dx4x7lmarbrZTsXjyghgqOV0YMH%7EIhV78TKTbHRd7SHOOR4A__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 009db56466f16115bde2f90d683a4d4c https://d1y502jg6fpugt.cloudfront.net/16159/archive/files/9228135b4ae80c8deba4da2d498b653e.pdf?Expires=1779321600&Signature=AnX8fD7PZkewd7xkp75Nqvos7xMBVfwFncq9zEw8fvp9JpOTl5VJ-SAlNLf%7EfxMQknQ8XwVr8Qq%7Eau1ZpRxPrJ%7ES6-sqWDd5oLfppamfb2N%7EBlLhbsKnMKfgxpD74v-4xmTe50On7fJvXzdaGgPzNycQI5mgSSRzlTgSpwjWxQE4emFdxlFG4JaKBUmQlJEnvam8BFJ7-PfvzB9JB%7EqrWDYB97iRkd65RvZM45jsgsTrjZ7Qqsq7eMe9wn6ayrIanu4SWjwJxjY3GNJA31%7EcVT6XV0lutKloeFjIZYfm-Xq2ae2Uogabw7-T3aOsHwj9WQpCKbvX2sTXz06Qniy%7EEQ__&Key-Pair-Id=K6UGZS9ZTDSZM 66885a1a9ebe362a9b1bc980e0f290c8 PDF Text Text Transcript of an Oral History Interview Conducted for University of Maryland Course IMMR 400 – Spring 2020 Instructor: Dr. Chiles Interviewer: Harshaan Grewal Interviewee: Kul Sandhu Interviewee’s Country of Origin: India Introduction: This interview between Harshaan Grewal and Kul Sandhu discusses Kul’s immigration from India to the US, as well as Kul’s family, marriage, school, and philosophies of life. Kul talks about political and religious conflict he and his family experienced in India. Kul also speaks about convincing his family to let him move to the US, the way in which his grandmother advocated for him to move, as well as eventually sponsoring his family to become US citizens themselves. Key Words: India, Sikh, education, marriage, sponsor, friendship, Punjab, green card, John F. Kennedy Harshaan: Um. Okay so it says recording on my end. So, with that we’ll get started. So, first question I want to ask um is what part of India did you grow up in? Kul: Well, I was born in 1937. And uh I lived with my grandmother from ’37-’45. That means, you know—no ‘37 to ‘47, not ‘45. Ten years. Because my father had a job at different places. He was an agriculture/horticulture specialist. So, he was at jobs with my mom and my sister next to me and one of my brothers next to. And so, grandmother was all by herself, and knowing that Indian families, what happened is my grandfather’s two brothers were living in the same complex. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: And their—and my grandmother was young, she got married when she was 13 years old, and my grandfather never came back from the World War. And my [grand]father, he never knew that my father, you know, father was going to be born. And father, my father did not see his father. And so, what we did, she [Kul’s grandmother] wanted some sort of security, that there’s a male member is with her. Unless—even though I was a little kid. But what it was that the other people said, “Okay, why don’t you get married to us,” so they could get the land and all those things, you know. That was the— People did that in India for being, you know, uh that. There were two—my grandfather’s two brothers were living in the same complex. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: So, in 1947—that was India at that time too, ‘37-’47. �Harshaan: Oh, that’s right, that’s right. Kul: When it became Pakistan, then we had to leave quickly. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: And um you know [I was] 10 years old and all that stuff. Um and with my other brother, two sisters and one brother, my parents. We all—in the middle of the night we left because we were afraid that somebody would kill us also. So, we travelled in uh nighttime, and hide in the sugar cane fields to save our lives. Harshaan: Oh, wow. Kul: Uh, and it took us almost about a week from where they were. My father was the horticulture manager for “Maharaja of Faridkot” who had 2,500 acres of beautiful fruit trees, all that stuff, you know. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And uh he was given a car and a hor—white horse, and other stuff, but we had to leave it in an emergency. So finally, when we came to the border, which was a river in Punjab. There were five rivers. Two—two and a half [of the rivers], you know, they were in what became Pakistan and the other one stayed with Punjab. So, we came in around uh one o’clock in the morning or something, because that’s the time they said, you know, that you could—would let you cross. It was our family and a few other people in the bus. The other four trucks were loaded with people, refugees, they were not allowed to [cross], you know. So, there was one policeman, Muslim policeman that came in, he said, with tears he came in and said, “You have only 15 minutes to live, because we have orders to kill all of you. You cannot cross the border.” Because my father was a known person, you know, and all that. So, quickly we got into the cars and, you now, all went back to another village, and there father—my father made a deal with the policeman over there in that little town or village that if we could go—because he [the policeman] told us earlier that “My family, son and his family is stuck back on the other side and they won’t let—let them come.” And so, you know, we said, “Why don’t we make a trade?” At three o’clock in the morning we crossed the border. Harshaan: Oh wow. Kul: Because of the trade. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And then, you know, from there we were travelling to my mother’s place that was—we were in Punjab, which is India now. And uh in Ludhiana, that’s where my mother’s village was, we saw all sorts of uh what you call uh dead bodies on the sidewalks on the side of the road, dogs and birds eating. This is what the, you know, situation we went through. And for 10 years old it was kind of hard to believe. And uh so what we did was that my father when we came in, �he became a big officer because he was educated, he got his bachelor’s degree in science in 1936. I was born in 1937 in Lahore which was the capital of Punjab at that time. So, um he got a good job and we moved to uh a city called Karnal, which was 73 miles from New Delhi. That was Punjab also at the same time. And he was a big officer and uh, you know, all the stuff. And um the land we had left behind because we were farmers, and that land had to be from that Lyallpur, you know, that little city, we had to go to Hassar another little province. Uh but luckily what happened was that my father being—knowing all that stuff, he found a law that said if you happened to have some land that we’ll put the other land with it too. So, he went and bought thirteen acres of land just outside Karnal, which was undeveloped, but we will take care of it. That’s how we came into, you know, um after—in ‘48, ‘49 we bought the land and we build the house there. Okay? And then when I grew up there, we walk for three miles to go to high school and then to college. And uh I went to a Punjab college called Dyaal Singh College. And that college is the one which uh was three miles, so what we do we went there, you know, and that’s where we survived. After I graduated, then my father had some influence and all that stuff and uh he— in 1959 I got my undergraduate degree. And it was called Punjab University Dyaal Singh College. And my father was quite influential, so he working out with different judges and all those people because he had a good post also. So, he had somebody came in, he say, “I have a problem with my uh self, you know, could you help us out, you know, to talk to the judge.” So, he thought he could do that, you know, and get out of it. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: My sister’s [mother’s] brother, my Mama ji, he was there too, and they gave him piece of paper, “This is the case, this the name of the people, let’s give this to judge and they’ll be fine.” And I took the bicycle, I went part of the way and discovered I didn’t bring the piece of paper, so what am I going to do? When I came in secretly to pick up the piece of paper, um I overheard the conversation going on between my mother, her brother, and my father. He said, “Now—” remember, I’m the oldest in the family of five, and they said, “You know, he’s grown up, we— and he finished his college, we’ll get him a good job and get him married.” And I said, “Oh my god, I don’t want to get married!” You know? (both laugh) I—I took the piece of paper, went back, and took it to, you know, meeting his judge. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: One of my friends from my uh mother’s village, uh Ram Prakash Mahant, lived across from them. He went to Canada to study, and uh he wanted me to come to Canada. And when I learned that they’re trying to get me married and all that stuff, they want me to take care of the farm and all that stuff, I didn’t want to do it. Harshaan: Right. Kul: So, I wrote to Ram Prakash Mahant, “Hey, I think, you know, I need to get out from here, and um this is a situation I’ll explain to you later, but uh see if you could help me out.” I sent the papers to him, and in Vancouver, University of British Columbia, uh he was—that’s where he was going to school. He sent me the papers, I applied for it, I got the admission. �Harshaan: Oh wow! That’s awesome. Kul: Once I got the admission, immigration used to be fairly simple, you know. So, when I got the admission, I got the—even the card room assigned in the dorm, all that stuff ready to go. I was going to be going to the engineering school. And what happened when I went to the—I told my father, okay, once I made up my mind, I don’t want to stick around there. And in my heart it was, “I don’t want to get married, I want to go, and you know, why not?” Harshaan: Yeah, yeah. Kul: And my uh—I told my father I gotta go. I want to go. He said, “Oh you can’t go.” And I said, “Oh, but Ram Prakash is there and I’ve been talking to him.” And he says, “I don’t care.” Then I use my grandmother as a weapon. Because I spent first ten years with my grandmother to be really helpful to her even though I was a kid. I told my grandmother, “I want to go.” And she said, “You sure?” I say, “Yes.” I said, “I do want to go.” And she said, “Okay, well let’s see what I can do.” In the meantime, I went to the embassy in New Delhi. Uh, Canadian embassy. And I gave them the paper. They said, “Looks everything good, and we’ll get the medical done, and then come back in ten days, you know, fifteen days with medical, and then we’ll proceed it.” I got my whole test done by the local hospital. Once I went to the doctor, I went over there for my visa. (laughing) They flunked me for my stool examination. I got it done, it was okay, they said—I said, “Here is the proof.” And they said, “No, it’s our doctor who decides that.” That’s when I found out that I forgot to give them under the table some money. Five rupees (laughing). Harshaan: Five rupees. That’s it? Kul: Five rupees. That’s it! Harshaan: Oh wow. Kul: So, I told my guy, you know, I said, “When can I come back?” He said, “Get ready in three months and come back.” Harshaan: That’s a long time. Kul: Within three months, my admissions and everything was going to go away. So, I said, “Hey, this is a situation, what should I do?” So, privately I just, you know, uh went to the library and pick up the other universities in United States. So, where I could—finally, I applied to a couple of places. I got accepted at United States. In Nashville, Tennessee. Harshaan: Nashville. I remember you [inaudible] Kul: So—yeah. So, I got out of things and I went to the embassy and that’s the day Kennedy, our president here, he’s the one who won the election. And they were in a good mood and all that stuff, and they said, “Okay, go to the doctor.” And I went to the doctor where everything was �clear. I—I had—I got the passport earlier, um and then I came back and my father said, “No, you can’t go.” I said, “Well, I have to, look I have this passport, visa, all that stuff.” He said, “Nope, I’m not paying for it.” So, I went to grandma and said, “Here’s the situation.” She said, “I know you want to go, I want to you be happy, so let’s see what I could do.” She went to my father, she said, “He has to go because I want him to go.” He said, “No, he can’t go.” She said, “Okay, I’m going on a hunger strike, and I’m not going eat a bite ‘til that happens that he goes.” And he tested her for one—one and a half days. She did not eat anything. And finally, he—my mother happy for me because she wanted me to go. She talked to her brother and her brother said, “Go ahead, you know, if you are going to go, I’ll pay for your ticket.” Yeah, and he lived about, you know, two hundred miles away from us. Yeah. So, finally that give me the courage, my grandmother ended her one day on a hunger strike, and finally, hey, I did—I got the ticket on BOAC [British Airways] up on the plane. That was the month of uh November 1960. And I came to New York. First, you know, the plane landed in London, and I had to change the flight from there, you know, for New York. (chuckling) And uh, what happened was, they said, “Lunch is on the go— uh house.” Harshaan: Oh wow. Kul: And there were forks and knives, I didn’t know how to use those! (Harshaan laughs) My stomach is hurting I am already full! Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: (laughing) But, you know, I just hopped on the plane and came to New York. The flight came in uh, oh somewhere close to 10:30-11:00 in New York. Then I had to change the flights to go from there to Nashville, Tennessee, and that flight reached there around 3:30 AM. And uh I thought, you know, uh, you know, everything’s open, but 3:30 AM was very early—dark. And I went to those people at the staff, you know, airline staff and said, “What should I do?” They said, “You can’t stay here.” You know, because everybody’s gone and all that stuff. So, I said, “What should I do?” He said, “You gotta go to a hotel or motel.” So, I went to the motel, I mean I had some money in my pocket, and I went to the motel, uh and I stayed there for two hours and then I went to the University. Harshaan: Oh, in your dorm, right? Kul: Yeah. And uh for two hours I paid for the night. And after I paid my first semester’s fees, uh I had about $7.20 in my pocket. But the fees were to cover my two semesters, you know. Harshaan: Right, right, yeah. Kul: So, uh I—I was in pretty good shape, you know, in that sense. I don’t know whether you could see my picture or not. This is what I was in turban. (shows picture but not in a way that camera can see it) Harshaan: You mind holding it up a bit? You mind angling it up a little more? �Kul: Oh, higher? Harshaan: Yeah, higher. Kul: (shows picture of about nine men in suits) Harshaan: Okay, not I can see it. Kul: Yeah. I’m the one in the middle right here. Yeah, there were two other Indians, one on this side with the turban (points to the right) and the other guy from Bombay. Harshaan: I see. Kul: And other people of course from different places, you know. Okay? So, what happened was that, you know, I—I said, “Well—” The admission I got was Auto Diesel College, but you know, I wear a necktie and suit and all that stuff. Um I didn’t want to be a mechanic or anything. Harshaan: Right. Kul: So, I went to university called Peabody College. Harshaan: Peabody? Kul: Peabody. And it’s Vanderbilt University and Peabody College program. I went—I went for my graduate school there, got admission, and start my work there. And then I had figured out, you know, I—you know, I’ll start majoring in geography because my undergraduate degree was in geography uh and English and physics. So, I was doing okay, uh then I had to try to figure out, you know, what I’m gonna do because a master’s degree in arts is not gonna get me a good job. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And it’s only side I worked at gas station, you know, whatever it is to that, you know, stuff. And finally, I went to couple of places to get a better field. My parents wanted me to be either a doctor or engineer. But, uh my math was not that good, so I didn’t want to be an engineer. Doctor, I didn’t want to be a doctor because in high school in India, I took the uh, you know, b— biology and botany, and the teacher, first they said, “You know, we are going to cut a rabbit and all that stuff.” And I said, you know, it was in high school. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: They said there would be blood and all. I kept crying, I said, “I want to get out.” So, I'm looking around at all that stuff, I wonder if there’s something I could do which is a good combination: do a good service, and I don’t wanna do too much math. I found the—that there is a program called City and Regional Planning. Yeah. So, I talked to people and all the stuff, and I �discovered, you know, that I could do a good service by planning good communities and job places and uh hospitals and all those things, you know, that really could provide a good service. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And, uh, and then I won’t see blood or I won’t see the math! So, what I did was that I did my graduate work at Peabody-Vanderbilt, and then I look for where should I go to—go to get the degree. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: I went to Virginia Tech. Yeah, in Virginia Tech they—I came in in 1964. Okay? And in 1964, um, you know, I got into the urban planning, city and regional planning. And one thing I want to say, in Nashville, Tennessee, the—looking at the questions, you know, how did the Americans treated me? Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: Yeah. What happened was that, you know, I was working on gas station and all, and I used to have a turban and all that stuff. And then they came on bus and go to, you know, the school or something. And couple of people in the bus started pushing me around. And uh I said, “Why you are doing that to me?” And they said, you know, “Uh, we don’t want Cubans here.” The Cuban crisis in 1963 was going on. Harshaan: Oh, so they [inaudible] Kul: I said, “I’m not Cuban! Here’s my passport, I’m from India.” They said, “Oh, you can have a passport made anytime you want to.” Harshaan: Wow. Kul: So, I went to the driver, I told him, “Would you please stop the bus so that I could get out because they’re bothering me?” Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And even though he was also an Indian in America, he said, “I can’t stop it, there’s no stop.” So, I just, you know, came out very depressed, and you know, a little bit mad about it. Harshaan: Yeah, that’s terrible. Kul: And that’s when I cut my hair first time. So that at least nobody there gonna push me around. But one was that, the other one, my name was Kul and they call me names like “Coolwinder, Side-winder,” those things (laughing). So, back to Virginia Tech. I went first, uh, first semester there uh and uh I was running out of money. Blacksburg is a very small place, there were not that many jobs. �Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: I said, “Well, gotta do something.” Uh, and also at the same time, Virginia Tech, because it was a small town, uh Blacksburg, so they were bringing the whole class to George Washington, University in Washington, so that they know city big enough for planning situation. There was the whole summer, whole class came here with professors. Harshaan: I see. Kul: So, I said I gotta find out, you know, where I could work and go to school, and it’s a city rather than rural planning. (laughs) So, what I did was that I came here in a catholic university in Washington, DC. I talked to the head of the department because that school had only night classes. Harshaan: You said this was Catholic University? Kul: Catholic University. So, I came to 1965, you know, to Catholic University. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And uh I work with Maryland National Capital Park and Planning Commission. Harshaan: I see. Kul: As a student in the city planning—planning department. Harshaan: I see. Kul: And from there, uh I went to classes, and in 1966, I graduated with a master’s degree. Harshaan: I see. Kul: In city and regional planning. And I had the job for the Planning Commission, then I worked for the consulting firm, and then I want to—I have some friends in Blacksburg, so I went back to Blacksburg um including when my girlfriend was there (both laugh). So, I went there back and worked with a consulting firm in Roanoke, Virginia. Yeah. And uh one of my old professors he was also working there, so it worked out very well for both of us, you know, at work. So, I worked at the Madon & Madon, it was, you know, a consulting firm. In regional planning and architecture and engineering. So then, uh what happened was um in 1967, I got my green card from the student card, student visa. Then ‘67 I work with the firm and once I got my green card, I said, “I got to go back to India now to visit.” After seven years. Harshaan: Yeah. �Kul: I—I went to London. Ram Prakash, my friend from Canada, he finished his degree and he was working in England. Uh, and I went to visit them, and I said, “Hey, while I’m here I might as well learn something.” I had a book under my arm that said Europe Word of the Day. Uh, so I went to Paris, back from Paris, you know, I got on a train and went through uh Germany, Austria—Germany, Switzerland, and Austria. Just touring around. And I had a green card, so you know, there was no problem there. So, from there I came back and—to uh, you know, back to Paris to book a flight from there all the way to Delhi. Harshaan: Hmm. Kul: And by the time I get there, my grandmother is already gone. She died. But everybody was there, and they were just happy there. And, you know, after me is my sister, that is your grandma, and then um my brother, and then my sister which is uh Honey’s mom, and then there was my other brother who was uh Naunihal. Okay? Over there my parents say, “Hey, he’s back.” Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: Oh no before that, when I was getting off from the plane, uh there was a German lady with two kids. That were blonde. I was trying to help them out. And everybody said, “Oh, he’s married her and has a family.” I said, “No, that’s not my wife!” (both laughing) Just I was trying to help these little kiddies. I said, “Well, you know, I’ll go back to her when I go back. No, I’m not married.” Um, and then what I did was that my father already advertised for finding a girl for me. I was very much opposed to it because I came to see you guys. And—but, you know, they wanted to do that. It’s, I mean, parents, you know, kind of thing. And then uh I said, “Well, okay.” He said, “You can’t go back if you don’t get married.” And I said, “Hey, I told those people at work I coming back by such and such day, you know, I don’t—I can’t let that expire.” Harshaan: Right. Kul: So, finally I said, “Hey, you know, let’s play a game with them.” I said, “Well, let’s see what you could find. And I’m—but condition is I’m gonna see some time and they could see me also.” And they will have some—some presentations, you know, and watching—I am introduced to them. They have that you know, Mecca return and blah, blah, blah, blah. You know? So, I saw some girl uh I didn’t want to get married. And uh some saw me, some said “yes,” other said “reject.” It’s okay! Because I was clean shaved and all that stuff, you know. And finally, there was a girl who was an ar—degree finishing up architecture. Uh, in India, one of the schools. She lived in Chandigarh. And they said, “Okay, let’s go see her.” Architecture and city planning was close. I said, “Why not?” You know, my dad, your grandpa, myself and uncle fly in from New York; we went to Chandigarh. When we went to the girl’s house and they said, “She’s on the train on her way.” And then she said, you know, “She is sick. She’s not going to be here for a few days.” So, I said, “Well, you know, okay.” Then there was another one also advertised. While we’re here, why not? You know, two blocks from there was her. So, we went to this office and that’s where your auntie Pashi’s dad’s business was. He showed me the picture, I said, “Hey, looks good though.” And then after—it was closer to the end of the day, and I said, “Is there any way we could get back to you?” And he said, “Don’t you want to see the girl? In person?” I said, “Hey, that’s my kind of man.” You �know? He had a car, so he loaded us up and took us to his house. And your auntie Prakash she was little [guarded?] also. And they let us talk to her for a little bit, you know. And at that time, we found out that one of my professors when I was in the college, and her professor, they’re the same person! So, we talked about that for the time. And all that stuff, and I kind of liked it because they said, you know, “One of our sisters is married to an engineer, uh and the other sister is married to somebody in London.” All that stuff, I said, “Hey, that look like cosmopolitan.” Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: So, I said, “Well, okay, we’ll get back to you.” And my father-in-law, Pashi’s mom—or dad, he said, “I have a meeting in Bombay.” He was in transportation and finance business. He said, “I have a meeting in Bombay, I am going there for only four day. If we hear from you, you let us know after you talk to your family, and if not, that’s totally understandable.” That was another thing that sold me, hey, that’s the kind of family I like! (Harshaan laughs) So, I came in and it was three days and fourth day was approaching. And I showed her to my mom and my sisters and everybody, you know, grandma and all. And they really liked that girl—they [the girl’s family] gave me a picture. And my father still wasn’t there (laughs). So, next day—next morning I got on the bicycle, we didn’t have a telephone at the farm. So, I went to three miles peddling bicycle to the post office, and I dialed the, uh, I dialed the telephone number for Pashi’s, you know, dad. I said, “I’m it.” (Harshaan laughs) He said, “Oh, did you talk to your parents?” I said, “Almost everybody. But not one.” Then, uh, he said, “Okay, have them contact us.” You know? So, my father came in, I told him, he was upset, all that stuff. But once I told him about the family, um he said, “Okay, let’s look into it.” And then we found out, you know, that Pashi’s uh, Pashi’s [relative] was married to someone my father knew. And also, Pashi’s cousin uh was married to another person and we— my father knew about it. So, we looked—he looked at it, “Hey, that’s a good bondage.” Because when he was in Karnal everybody knew him, and that way he knew some people. And we found that connection. Harshaan: That’s good, yeah. Kul: So, it was 17th of December, 1967. I was uh in a hurry, you know, because I got to go back to work. I said, “Okay.” Engagement was New—uh Christmas Eve. Um and wedding was New Year’s Eve. 1967. Within two weeks. Harshaan: Wow yeah. Kul: We did that. (claps hands for emphasis) And uh January of 1967, I said, “I gotta go.” They said, “Okay, you go and then you—she could stay here and all.” I said, “No. That was not part of the deal,” (Harshaan laughs) “she comes with me.” So, finally, they said, “Okay, we’ll see if she gets all the papers.” We got the passport done, I took her to the American Embassy, and at that time uh what happened was that the clerical in the front said, “No, no, we don’t have time, and blah, blah, blah.” And Pashi was with me. And then I said, “Hey, I came so far over here, can I talk to one of the, you know, seniors—your supervisors?” I said, “Okay.” There was a young guy, and uh looked pretty good, uh young. I talked to him about the, you know, situation. And �um I want to find out more about him. He said, “Oh, so how long you been here?” He says [I said], “About five, six months.” He said, “Well, you just came in, what about the family?” I said, “I just got married, I didn’t want to leave my wife, I brought her.” I said, “This is it, that’s the reason I’m here, I want to take my wife with me.” He said, “Come back tomorrow—day after tomorrow—no, come back tomorrow. You got a visa.” (Harshaan laughs) That’s how she got the visa. Harshaan: Aww, that’s wonderful. Kul: So, we came in and uh we came to London. Pashi’s sister over there and family. We spent one week with them, I was very pleased with them because good nature, you know. That was Pashi’s older sister. The other one, middle one was in Can—Canada. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: And uh—no, wait at that time she was not in Canada. And so, we came in and we got settled. And um in 1967 we were in Salem, Virginia, close to Roanoke, between Roanoke and Blacksburg. And then I got a job up in Old Town Alexandria. So, we—Pashi didn’t have a driver’s license, but she knew some driving, so we bought a little Volkswagen. No clutch, change gears. So, I had a three-cylinder all of books and finer things, we didn’t have much loaded up in the car. We came to Washington. And uh this is the Washington in 1963, when I went to see the World’s Fair, I drove my Volkswagen and I got stuck in Washington, DC. Every time I go around the Washington Monument, I couldn’t go anywhere the traffic was so bad. So, I figured out, you know, what should I do? Well, there was absolutely no parking. No parking there, I knew the policeman was going to come. Policeman came right away, he said, “Can’t you read the sign?” I said, “Officer, just tell you the honest truth, I am stuck in this damn traffic. I am—I have to go to New York. Uh before it got too dark.” And uh, um, “I knew that you could help me out.” He said, “Follow me.” He put me in the right area and he got me out of the city (laughs). Harshaan: Wow. Kul: The city, at that time I say, “I hate the city, I don’t ever want to move there.” But then I went to school here, Catholic University and all that. And we loved it. Ever since, loved this place so much. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And then, you know, I—I think I found out, you know, people wanted—my brother came, uh and my parents came, then uh Auntie came, and then uh my father died and your parents came in. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: Only—no, not parents, your grandparents came in before we cremated him. Then I think, you know, your mom and Gogi came in and all that stuff. And my parents went back and brought �Bobby also. And that’s how I am, and I love it, I would never go anywhere else. This is my side of the story. Harshaan: Such a beautiful, beautiful—first, thank you so much for sharing all of that. Kul: Yeah. Harshaan: How in depth you were. Kul: Hey, look at this. [Kul holds up an old newspaper article.] Harshaan: Is that you? Can you turn it up a bit? Kul: Yeah! [Title of the article is “Visitor from India tells how Parents Choose Children’s Mates.” The article shows a picture of a younger Kul.] Harshaan: (laughs) Wow! (Kul laughs) Is this in the Punjabi newspaper or American? Kul: No, no, there was American family and they ask me what kind of food you could make. And I said, “I don’t know! Let’s try it.” So, I made something, and they put it out, “Hey, good cook, good food.” Harshaan: Wow. Kul: And then in another one [holds up another newspaper article], there were a couple of Indian families renting a house, and uh, see this is what my life was. Harshaan: That is so interesting. I love that. Kul: Yeah, and a couple of other things I want to show you. Uh let’s see. [Holds up picture of himself] This one was me when I came. Harshaan: Do you mind angling up? Just a bit. Oh wow. Kul: And then after the people tried to throw me from the bus this is what I was. [Holds up another picture of himself.] Harshaan: This was after you cut your hair? Kul: (laughs) Yeah. And that’s the way life was, buddy. And uh that’s my side of the story, any else you want to ask? Harshaan: Yeah, absolutely. I don’t wanna like uh move around too far, so if you don’t mind, I want to start from kind of like the beginning of your story and just work forward. Kul: Say it again. �Harshaan: Um, I just—I just said I kinda wanna like work from the beginning like— Kul: Okay, sure, sure. Harshaan: —don’t wanna bounce around too much. Kul: No problem. Harshaan: Um, so, I know this personally, but I just wanna ask for the camera, um what is your religious background and how were members of your religion treated in India? Um and did this play any role—any uh role in affecting your decision to uh coming to the United States? Kul: Uh, my family they were all Sikhs. With the turbans and all that stuff. I remember I was three years old my grandmother will say, “You have to wear a turban.” And I said, “Why?” She said, “You are a Sikh.” In addition to that, she wanted to have a guy in a turban when the grandfather’s brother die, [and people were] trying to be rough on my grandma. That say, “Hey, there’s a man over here.” Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: (both laugh) I was treated very well. All Sikhs had to get out of that part of Punjab. Yeah. So, I had my turban and even in India, you know, my grandmother did a part, so she even made me do some parts. I remember some parts, you know. So, that’s how I was and up until I left India I get treated very well because it is the educated family and all that stuff, you know. And the college I went to was [run by a very rich man]. And he’s the one who has the college in Lahore where I was born. And in Pakistan, he wanted to move that, but there was a clause that they say, “Your college cannot move from this place.” So, there is still a college in Lahore and it’s where I graduated. Harshaan: That is very interesting. Kul: And uh I am still, you know, still the Sikh. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: Yeah, and the only place I went to in Nashville, Tennessee couple of colleges—uh, no couple of churches. Just to tell the story when the Bengal tiger comes from. (both laugh) And I know how to ride a camel. All those things, those kinds of funny things, you know. And then I got an invitation for a dinner party with those people. (laughs) Harshaan: Mm-hm. It all works out in the end. Kul: It does, yeah. �Harshaan: That is wonderful. Um, you kind of addressed this already, but I just wanted to ask the question specifically. Kul: Sure. Harshaan: Um, so in terms of economic and political factors, what were some of the factors in India at the time that made you decide leave? If any at all. Kul: In India we were very, very good, as I said my father had a good job, and then we had land, and owned our own farm where we built a house, and we grew uh rice, wheat, all sorts of beans, and uh potatoes, tomatoes, all the vegetables, sugarcane, and you name it. That’s what we grew. And we were fairly okay. There was not any problem. And uh my youngest brother, he was born in 1950, June 1950. And uh after I came here, you know, poor thing he had um, what you call? Cancer. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: And he died. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: And so that’s part of life, you know. And uh I was thinking of even getting him over here too. But, you know, fate took him earlier. But that’s part of it. So, everybody was Sikh and we were treated very well in India. When I came in [to the US] I had difficulties with the turban I told you about. But I didn’t change. In Nashville, Tennessee there was hardly any Indians, that’s why those people think I am from Cuba. But there was no gurdwara [Sikh temple], there was no Sikhs or anything. Uh, there was one doctor came in to Vanderbilt University. Uh, and I saw them walking on the street close to the Vanderbilt University, that’s where he was going to do research, and then that’s the only person I saw in Nashville, Tennessee. And uh ‘til he died in New York, he had three daughters, all doctors, they married all doctors, their kids are all doctors. And a few years ago, nine doctors in the family, then he died. His wife still lives in New York, and one daughter lives in New York, one in Philidelphia, one in San Francisco. Harshaan: Hm. Kul: And I still talk to them. Harshaan: Hm. That’s very sweet. Kul: Yeah. Harshaan: That’s cool. Um, let me see. Um, I guess you kind of touched on this a little bit as well, but what were your first thoughts when you first came to New York and to Nashville? Kul: Yeah. �Harshaan: Anything, even like when you stayed at the motel. What were your first initial thoughts about the US? Kul: Uh, UN? Harshaan: The—the United States. Kul: Oh, United States. I was so much excited to come not even knowing what United States is all about, other than conversation with Ram Parkash. You know, Canada and United States was same. Uh, and uh in my excitement, I was very much pleased that I was there. I did not know anybody when I came to Nashville, Tennessee. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: I did not have anybody that I communicated those things, you know. I took it, it was people—I did speak some English, but not the same kind of English they were speaking. Nobody was prejudiced against me, you know, they were understanding people. And in those days what they used to do is that a foreign student, a family will take those in to make them comfortable, get adjusted. I found a family in Nashville, Tennessee. Harshaan: Oh, really? Kul: And then when I came to Blacksburg, I found another family, which adopted me for three weeks. Harshaan: Wow. Kul: Yeah. And in our house, these Aztec paintings— Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: Well, that’s the person that you know that was my family. She was a painter. And I enjoyed it. And when I came into Washington, by that time I grew out of the whole thing and I was okay. So, I—I like to—the more I got closer to people [claps hands for emphasis], the more I loved, you know, USA. Harshaan: Of course. Kul: And I enjoyed every moment, nobody was uh, you know, trying to take advantage of me other than two drunk people in the bus. Harshaan: Hm. �Kul: So, that was—and I forgave them. I said, “Well, that’s big deal.” And they don’t know it. And, you know, when I have in my hand, passport says Indian and turban, they—those people, they don’t wear turbans. (laughing) Harshaan: Yeah. It’s not important to them. Kul: But everybody treated me very well. Harshaan: That’s good. Kul: I made some good friends. I friend—I met some people in my hard times, other than financially, they helped me out. Yeah, and uh I, you know, hey, I saw—I played around very much with people and had a good time. I had a couple girlfriends there and here, that was okay too. So, that—that’s my, you know, I—I from that time onward even until today, this is where I want to be. And this is where I want to die too. Harshaan: That is so beautiful. Kul: If and when the day comes. Harshaan: Of course. Kul: As a matter of fact, I was telling your auntie, “I think I’m ready to donate my organs to your hospital.” (laughs) So, that we don’t have to go to funeral home. Harshaan: Hm. That’s brave of you. Kul: Yeah? That’s how what I believe. That’s what I want to do. Harshaan: To give back? Kul: Yes. Harshaan: I’ve always seen that as your character. That is so awesome. Kul: Yeah. Harshaan: That is really cool. Um— Kul: Wait, you say “cool,” that’s me! (both laugh) I didn’t officially change my name. But we went to the, you know, citizens and said, “What’s your name?” And I said, “Kul Mandar in parenthesis ‘cool.’” And on the passport, it says “Kul Sandu.” �Harshaan: Your passport says, “Kul Sandu?” Kul: And they said, “Yeah we know that you’re cool, but what is your name?” And I said, “It’s K-U-L.” (both laugh) And then they said, “Kul.” And I said, “I told you that!” (both laugh) Harshaan: Yeah, that is funny. So, you mentioned earlier that you actually stayed with a family in the United States, um was that part of the admissions process to the university or was that something separate thing you decided to do? Kul: In Nashville, Tennessee I decided it. Harshaan: You did? Kul: Yeah. Harshaan: How did the university accommodate other people who were coming from different countries? Kul: Very well, very well. Harshaan: That’s good. Kul: Very well. Harshaan: That’s good. Kul: As a matter of fact, you know, uh wherever I went, being different, the American students as well as the faculty, they wanted to get close enough to find out more about you. And work with you. And toward the end hours every time the conversation, “Anything we could do, we’ll be there for you.” And that’s what gave me the strength to continue. Harshaan: That is huge yeah. Kul: And that’s what, you know, up until now and onwards, it’s a give and take. Because I had to give—I was giving something and they saw it and appreciate it. I saw something in them, I said, “This is worth every bit of where I want to be.” Harshaan: Absolutely. That is so—that is really big development, so I am glad you experienced that. Um, let’s see, so you already mentioned that you came by yourself, you mentioned how people treated you, you mentioned you came to New York. Uh, you did touch on this a little bit, but um what exactly was your first job when you came into Nashville? Was it the gas station? �Kul: Uh, I worked at a gas station. Then I was working in a uh—some sort of a organization, they have all sorts of books and they, you know, send out the materials to other people. Uh, this was all—you know, I went to give a talk to a church, I had mentioned it to you. And then, they said, “What do you do?” I said, “I don’t have any work here, but I’m trying to go to school, and I’m gonna do this thing, you know.” And they helped me get a job. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: You know, with the publication. I think it was some sort of religious company or something. But all we were doing is putting things into the envelope and, you know, doing that stuff. And also, some people, they whenever they had a party or something, as a student, they— they just help me out. “Why don’t you come join the party? Even though you may have to wash dishes, but still, you see, we party too.” That’s what we did! Harshaan: Wonderful! That’s really good. Also, just towards the college experience too, that you did that. Kul: Yeah. Harshaan: That’s wonderful. Um so, tell me about the people. I know you said you made a lot of friends; um I’m just wondering if you could elaborate more. Tell me about the people you met here and how your relationships are with them now. Kul: Well, the family—there were two families in Nashville, Tennessee I was very close to. Uh, one, the George’s family. Uh, George family. They didn’t have any kids and while I was there, they adopted a kid. I learned everything, you know, to play with the little kiddies. I wanted to do it because, you know, and then I even learn how to uh change diapers and, you know, that’s a good thing. And that’s—they became very close to me. Harshaan: Mm-hm. Kul: Up, from Nashville, Tennessee, when I graduated from Catholic University, they came for my graduation. Harshaan: Wow! Kul: And all that stuff. Unfortunately, their daughter—they adopted the daughter, she lives in Florida, she has a drug problem. And they had a son who was born to them who is in uh I think Chicago or somewhere. And uh, but uh they both died. And when I came to Blacksburg, there was a family called Pienkowskis. Jody Pienkowski, wife, she was a master’s degree from University of Wisconsin in medicine. Her husband got a PhD from the same university in et—in uh etymology. And he was a professor in another department in Blacksburg. In Virginia Tech. �And she was the artist who was painting and all. And they—they, up until now, I love them, they love me. And I took your [Kul’s wife and kids] to their house, I took them a few times. And they were invited for [Kul’s children’s] wedding. But they said that they were—they got a little too old. And so, they don’t travel anywhere. They didn’t have any kids of their own, so they adopted three kids, two boys and a girl. On the daughter’s wedding, we were there in Asheville, North Carolina. Harshaan: Oh wow. Kul: So, we are still very close. And as a matter of fact, uh I’m planning to take [Kul’s grandkids] to spend a weekend over there with them. Harshaan: Oh, that’s wonderful! Kul: Yeah. And they still, as a matter of fact, when Yasmine [Kul’s child] was born, I ask uh, you know, the professor’s name was Bob, Robert. And wife’s name was Jody, Jody Pienkowski. I told them, “Hey, I’m expecting a daughter, uh could you come here,” he had a good camera,” I said, “Could you come to Washington to take some pictures?” They both drove down from Blacksburg here, and when Yasmine was born, they took all the pictures. Harshaan: Oh wow. Kul: Yeah, they were that close. And still they are. Harshaan: Yeah, especially from that long ago too. Kul: I know, I know. Harshaan: 50 years now? That’s incredible. Kul: I know, I know! (laughing) Harshaan: That is wonderful though. Um, this question's a little bit subjective, but I’m just curious to hear what you have to say. Um, in the time that you spent from when you came here, so like the seven-year period from when you came here to when you went back to India, what would you say your—some of your greatest successes were? Kul: Greatest what? Harshaan: Successes. Kul: Uh to become a citizen. Uh getting green card. �Harshaan: Okay. Kul: That’s what was, you know, because that was my idea, that was my goal that I successfully do those things. Efficiencies of money, the efficiency of I did not know anybody, but my goal stayed there. I want to be here. I want to plant myself. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: Something like a tree that bears fruit that people enjoy in life. Harshaan: That’s really awesome. Kul: That’s the kind of philosophy I kept in mind and kept working on it. There was a fall, there was a crash, there was a flood. The tree lasted, bared fruit. You don’t see anybody, but this is my thinking, that that’s what I could do it. And that’s why also meeting that kind of people, I selected the field which I wanted to service. Have good living for people in residential communities. And good services by police and fire departments and the hospitals and all those things. And—other than politics (both laugh). I—I felt that I accomplished what I wanted to do. Harshaan: Absolutely. Kul: And I’m very happy. Even, for example, you know after I retired from Fairfax County, that’s where I was, and if anybody calls me and asks for advice, anything to do with zoning and planning. That’s what I want to do. Harshaan: That’s really cool just to hear. (Kul laughs) Um so, on the other side of that, during that period when you moved here to the US to when you went back to India, what would you say are some of the greatest hardships you faced? Kul: In India or here? Harshaan: In the US. Kul: Oh, in the US. Well, uh not having money. I had to find adjustments. I gave lectures [Kul’s video freezes] and did favors for families. I met a person who was an artist and when I was telling those stories, she said, you know okay—I said, “I don’t have much money to do this, this, this.” And then she said, “Okay, would you like to be make some money for whatever I tell you to?” I said, “You say it, and I’ll see what I could do.” She said, “We—I’m an artist and we have art school, we always look for models.” I said, “Huh?” So, I did some modeling. Harshaan: Oh wow. �Kul: And uh only thing was, some—one time they said, “Do you mind taking your clothes off?” You know, they want to do that kind of painting. I said, “No, my underwear is going to stay with me.” And they painted from my belly button up there. And uh I made money from there. When there were parties, I went to parties, washed the dishes, I would pick up all those things. And those things, they really helped me. And again, I never felt, you know, as I’m an educated person I threw away my dignity. No, I’m a human being. And if my hands were dirty, I could wash; if my mind was dirty, I could take a step back and think, wake up, we don’t have very many choices. Harshaan: That’s true, that’s very true. Kul: That’s how I worked it out. Harshaan: That is huge, that’s awesome and very difficult to do all in all. Um so, I know that you said that you brought [your wife] over here when you got married on New Year’s in 1968. Um, I’m just curious, what was that transition like for you and how were you able to adjust from kind of like working to being married and starting a family here? Kul: Yeah. Well, I think, you know, again, I grew up and I knew the system, the way husband and wife are. Right? And I knew the culture here, that people date and then fall in love. In India, they marry and then what should they do, you know? The parents say that. I went with my own philosophy and I practiced it and I’m happy with it. You could get married if you want to, continue good life, fall in love later on. That’s what I did. And this young lady, she’s a Libra and that means that you achieve balance. But it’s give and take. Harshaan: Of course, of course. Kul: And if you don’t give your heart to somebody, how do you expect to get a heart back? That’s love! Harshaan: That’s true. Kul: Exactly! Take any movie, they sing songs about, you know, heart and all that (both laugh). The other day, I was thinking, somebody was saying, you know, “Well, how does the heart make love to each other?” The heart does not have wings to fly to you, the heart matches to your heart even though they don’t talk, but if they click, that’s what life is all about. Harshaan: That is very true. What good wisdom. (Kul laughs) Um, final question: so, part of the reason, you know this, part of the reason my parents are both here is because you actually sponsored them. Um, so I’m just curious, what was the process of sponsoring other people, how is that process like? �Kul: Process in those days, the earlier days, it was very simple. One of the simplest things I’m ever gonna tell you. 1976 my parents came, okay? And they came on a visitor visa, which it was to expire in three months. When the third month came in, we knew that either they do some decision, which I’m going to ask them, or they do their, you know, money, all that stuff. So, I asked my parents, my mother was very outgoing, she had two years college in 1936, my father had a BS in agriculture, right? And my mother, even when she was coming first time here, she wanted to eat American food and not Indian food and my father, “Oh, big deal.” And my mother liked it very much. And especially Yasmine was a little baby at that time and she was very attached. This is the beauty in a female person, because they keep a kid in tummy for nine months, they know how to connect over the years. The, again, the male members of our culture said, “Ah, big deal. Fine. You do this thing and I’ll do this thing.” And that’s what I love, that kind of philosophy. And uh it’s uh, when we were married, we used to get letters from our home, our parents, from my father especially—I’m going to go back to that question you asked also. Is that “Do you have any babies yet?” And we said, “No.” Some other people came to our house from India and they said, “Maybe you should get married again, a man may think that your wife can’t have a baby.” And finally, I always wanted girls based on what I was saying, I like girls whether it’s a mom, whether it’s a sister, whether it’s a niece, or whatever. Or a girlfriend, I like women very much. And I said, “God,” we were expecting first baby, I said, “please God, I want a girl.” I wrote thirty-one names, only girls names. And your auntie agreed with me. We had Yasmine. We then—the second one, we said one is enough, but I said, if this girl needs some help and her husband doesn’t work with her, where is she going to go? To the blood relation. So, then we had [another daughter]. Going back to your question again. Um, repeat the question again. Harshaan: So, the question was that I know you sponsored a lot of people for citizenship in the United States, I’m asking what the process was like and um what you thought of it. Kul: Well, that I said I love people, especially, you know, so—and you were asking about also how was the system. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And when my parents’ third month came in, and I asked my parents—my mother liked it here, you know, as I said earlier. She said, “We’d like to stay.” We applied for it, within two weeks I got them a green card. Harshaan: That’s really quick, I guess when you have— Kul: The system was so easy. But also, they looked at it, I’m a stable person and all that stuff, and we are established, we are citizens, we love it, we adopted the country, and that’s what happened. But then the process went on and on, more people started abusing the system and �that’s why they became harder and harder. In today’s time, you know, if you are Cuba or Mexico or you’re face looks different, you can’t even come. So, it’s very—it was easy. Harshaan: That’s good, that’s good. Um, so this is the final question I have for you, and again, if you don’t want to answer this it’s totally fine, but I’m just curious, because in a historical sense, I know with my parents they came after the attack on the Golden Temple in 1984. Um and as you know, that caused a lot of pretty difficult relations among Sikhs in India where some would just get gunned down in the prison, some would be unlawfully arrested, and a lot of Sikhs feared for their life and turned to terrorist organizations. I’m just curious, did you know of anyone or did that even impact you at all in terms of sponsoring people, in terms of going to India, in terms of other people you knew in India? And if so, how did you react and what did you do in response to that? Kul: Well, I—What I thought was, when I came in, I had hardships. Again, financial and, you know, not knowing anybody. With determination, I’m here. Opportunities are great, opportunities are lesser and lesser every day in India. I start sponsoring. After my parents decided to come then I sponsored—my brother was already sponsored and he was here. Uh from that time onward, [I helped other family]. Then I went on, whoever want to. I counted it one time, who I had gotten the papers done plus they applied and got some of their brothers and sisters: 53 people. Harshaan: Wow. Kul: 53 people. And uh I started it, I started that, you know. Harshaan: All because you were the one who wanted to kind of— Kul: Exactly, that’s what I wanted to do because I believed in it. I cared for them, and not only that, I cared for anybody who could get a good opportunity this country provides for. Why not? Harshaan: Especially after all the hardships that Sikhs— Kul: Exactly. Because we learn through their lesson what really happened. And I was opportunity, you know, look at my opportunity. When I was in India, you know, politicians and all that stuff, and when I was here, Kennedy was visiting Vanderbilt and Peabody College. And I was sitting, you know, all the students were sitting there and he’s sitting in a car and the car is moving in front of us. I raised my hand, “Mr. President, I want to shake hands with you.” You know, like this, I was a student, I had a turban at the time. He tapped on the driver’s shoulder— those are the good times—and the car stopped, and they asked me—ordered me to the car, and I shook hands with him. Harshaan: Oh wow. �Kul: And I felt so good. I know that he was also a great person. And even this thing, hey, me $7.20 in my pocket, came in all that stuff, look what I can do. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: That is the beautiful part of this world. Harshaan: Yeah. Kul: And I’m not saying the other countries are not that good. Mankind, when they start thinking, what is good for human beings. For safety, welfare, and continuity, and togetherness, that’s what really is the most important part. And you don’t get that if you don’t love life you are living. Harshaan: That is very true. Um, that is all the questions I have written. But before I end the recording is there anything that you’d like to add in terms of your own experience or what you’ve noticed from others or anything else you’d like to comment on? Kul: Well, I feel—I feel good for change that help me with the help of God. I believe in it too. My parents, my grandmother, my Mama Ji, and others, and other people must’ve loved me. I came here, people I never knew, they loved me. My love made me another form of person. I cherish it, I will cherish it, I will promote it, anybody who get the opportunity to be something that, not only where they live or which country and all that, but whatever they want to do, wherever they want to do, come with a open heart, open mind, expand your hands, give your heart to everybody. Whether you speak one word or not of “I love you,” it is already injected in that person. As long as we do this to everybody, this is life I wish for everybody. I feel so happy, all the people I love, they’re here. Though they’re not here, I love humankind, humanbeings. And I will always wish all of you the best, safest, and peaceful life. That’s all I—I don’t know. Let me get my napkin. Oh gosh (crying). Harshaan: Thank you so much for sharing your entire story though. � Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Spring 2020 Interviews Oral History A resource containing historical information obtained in interviews with persons having firsthand knowledge. Interviewer The person(s) performing the interview Harshaan Grewal Interviewee The person(s) being interviewed Kul Sandhu Location The location of the interview Maryland, USA Original Format The type of object, such as painting, sculpture, paper, photo, and additional data MP3, MP4, docx, png Dublin Core The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/. Title A name given to the resource Interview of Kul Sandhu Description An account of the resource <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4bTG--Pj3s">Use this link to view the video of the interview.</a> <br /><br />This interview between Harshaan Grewal and Kul Sandhu discusses Kul’s immigration from India to the US, as well as Kul’s family, marriage, school, and philosophies of life. Kul talks about political and religious conflict he and his family experienced in India. Kul also speaks about convincing his family to let him move to the US, the way in which his grandmother advocated for him to move, as well as eventually sponsoring his family to become US citizens themselves. <br /><br />This interview was conducted as part of an undergraduate final project for the University of Maryland, College Park course IMMR 400 (Spring 2020). This course was led by Professor Robert Chiles of the Department of History, College of Arts and Humanities, and was sponsored by the Center for Global Migration Studies. Creator An entity primarily responsible for making the resource Harshaan Grewal Publisher An entity responsible for making the resource available Center for Global Migration Studies Rights Information about rights held in and over the resource The full rights of this oral history interview were given by the interviewee to the University of Maryland, College Park. This interview may be quoted from, published, or broadcast in any medium that the University of Maryland, College Park shall deem appropriate. Format The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource PDF, MP3, MP4, png Language A language of the resource English Type The nature or genre of the resource Oral History education friendship Green Card India marriage Punjab Sikh sponsor